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Old 12-12-2018, 06:44 PM   #31
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
One of the potential issues of a reaction bonus equal to +9/+17 is that it greatly increases the effect of influence skills. Even if the character possessed IQ and used Diplomacy at a default, they would have an effective skill of 13/21 (depending on who they were influencing). A character with Diplomacy-10 would have an effective Diplomacy-19/27.
Not all reaction modifiers affect any given influence skill, so it depends what the skill is, what the reaction bonuses come from, and what the situation is.
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Old 12-12-2018, 08:13 PM   #32
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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Not all reaction modifiers affect any given influence skill, so it depends what the skill is, what the reaction bonuses come from, and what the situation is.
Yes, quite. Voice is specified as giving bonuses to particular Influence (and other skills), so it follows that it does not give bonuses to the skills not listed. Sex Appeal is listed as getting bonuses from appearance, and double penalties for negative appearance, so other Influence skills that don't list appearance presumably don't gain from it. You can't just say, "Oh, well, I have a total of +N in reaction modifiers, so I make this roll at +N."
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Old 12-12-2018, 09:15 PM   #33
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

It would also result in talents like Allure giving doubled bonuses if you used a skill they covered on someone that they gave a reaction bonus against.

B359 notes that: "Modifiers: All your personal reaction modifiers (although the GM or the skill description may rule that some modifiers do not apply)...", which I take to mean that when I read the description for a skill (for example, Fast-Talk), and it says that Voice works, and lists some disads that apply, but mentions no other advantages, etc. that Fast-Talk is not intended to get a bonus from Reputation or Appearance except in exceptional circumstances.
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:37 PM   #34
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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Yes, quite. Voice is specified as giving bonuses to particular Influence (and other skills), so it follows that it does not give bonuses to the skills not listed.
Voice and so on give bonuses to skills even when those skills are not being used as Influence skills. That doesn't mean the general statement about reaction modifiers applying to influence skills is not also true.
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Old 12-12-2018, 11:00 PM   #35
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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Voice and so on give bonuses to skills even when those skills are not being used as Influence skills. That doesn't mean the general statement about reaction modifiers applying to influence skills is not also true.
I don't think it's reasonable to suppose that Voice gives you a bonus to Influence rolls based on Intimidation, nor probably on Streetwise. I suppose I could see it working with Savoir-Faire (High Society), but not necessarily with the other version.
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Old 12-13-2018, 12:51 AM   #36
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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I don't think it's reasonable to suppose that Voice gives you a bonus to Influence rolls based on Intimidation, nor probably on Streetwise. I suppose I could see it working with Savoir-Faire (High Society), but not necessarily with the other version.
I think that it's as reasonable as anything else that Vincent Price, Christopher Lee or Alan Rickman would be able to deliver a threat much more arrestingly than someone wiith an average, everyday voice. Absent theoretical Limitations, Voice seems to include, indeed typify, that sort of dramatic, authoritative speaking voice, full of self-assurance and conviction, and yes, easily imbued with malevolent and threatening undertones.

A pure clear singing voice is a Perk and/or points in Singing.
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Old 12-13-2018, 03:17 AM   #37
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
One of the potential issues of a reaction bonus equal to +9/+17 is that it greatly increases the effect of influence skills. Even if the character possessed IQ and used Diplomacy at a default, they would have an effective skill of 13/21 (depending on who they were influencing). A character with Diplomacy-10 would have an effective Diplomacy-19/27.
Lately as a player I moved away from betting on Influence Rolls because essentially worse Reaction Rolls: assuming you're building a face, skills are more expensive than reaction modifiers bang-per-buck, less versatile, and their function is to substitute for Reaction Rolls anyway. By comparison, Reaction Rolls of a face tend to have less of a chance of giving negative results and have a higher positive result. They're also less manipulative and less antagonistic towards the target N/PC.
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Old 12-13-2018, 03:57 AM   #38
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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Lately as a player I moved away from betting on Influence Rolls because essentially worse Reaction Rolls: assuming you're building a face, skills are more expensive than reaction modifiers bang-per-buck, less versatile, and their function is to substitute for Reaction Rolls anyway. By comparison, Reaction Rolls of a face tend to have less of a chance of giving negative results and have a higher positive result. They're also less manipulative and less antagonistic towards the target N/PC.
I build 'faces' with both, because many sub-rules sets, like the ones for trading in David Pulver's Pyramid articles call for specific skill rolls, and not merely reaction rolls.

As for (almost) always counting reaction modifiers for influence rolls - if this is done, Charisma isn't just mostly better than 'influence talents' (Smooth Operator, Allure, etc.), but is insanely better.
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Old 12-13-2018, 04:22 AM   #39
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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I think that it's as reasonable as anything else that Vincent Price, Christopher Lee or Alan Rickman would be able to deliver a threat much more arrestingly than someone wiith an average, everyday voice. Absent theoretical Limitations, Voice seems to include, indeed typify, that sort of dramatic, authoritative speaking voice, full of self-assurance and conviction, and yes, easily imbued with malevolent and threatening undertones.

A pure clear singing voice is a Perk and/or points in Singing.
Concur. To have an excellent voice in multiple modes (which is certainly covered by the Voice advantage), you must have good control over your voice. Obviously the advantage doesn't give you masterful control, but +2 is nothing to sneeze at.

As a side note, depending on your singing style you might have learned some quite Intimidating vocal tricks anyways - but they wouldn't be good for synergizing with, say, Sex Appeal. Well, not unless the person you're using it on has a thing for death metal growls (valid quirk?). Seems like a straight up synergy attempt though.
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Old 12-13-2018, 06:33 AM   #40
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Default Re: When do you use Reaction Rolls?

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I build 'faces' with both, because many sub-rules sets, like the ones for trading in David Pulver's Pyramid articles call for specific skill rolls, and not merely reaction rolls.

As for (almost) always counting reaction modifiers for influence rolls - if this is done, Charisma isn't just mostly better than 'influence talents' (Smooth Operator, Allure, etc.), but is insanely better.
I'm not sure which situations you're referring too. Looking over the rules for various social interactions, the following things work or can work through Reaction Rolls: confrontations with authority, gaining admission to places, asking organisations to help, getting a job, getting info from individuals or crowds, making speeches (can even replace the Public Speaking skill), commercial transactions, seduction and romance . . . Seems like anything that can be handled by an Influence Roll can always be handled by a Reaction Roll, because Influence Rolls are pretty much by definition a substitute for Reaction Rolls.

Sure, there are skill rolls which aren't Influence Rolls, but those aren't normally directly influenced by reaction mods either (though some traits may give both the RR bonus and a direct skill bonus, which of course do not stack).
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