Gurps is dying a slow death - Page 4

Sunrunners_Fire · 05-08-2011, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nanoboy

Posting things on occasion would be nice. I subscribed a while back, but I never see anything.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Steve-...es/13976629462 ? ... the fan page.

-or-

http://www.facebook.com/sjgames ? ... the official page ... this one had stuff posted as recently as May 8th. Which would be today. :)

Mgellis · 05-08-2011, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stripe

As someone said, table-top gaming has seen a lot better days. :( World of Warcraft-like video games really put the hurt on us.

I think with Dungeon Fantasy and Monster Hunters, SJG is moving in the right direction, though.

If something like that was created for sci-fi gaming, it would just be another feather in SJ's hat, IMO.

Now, if SJG just took a look at Piazo's game plan for Pathfinder and went as close as possible to that with Dungeon Fantasy and Monster Hunters, GURPS would really start pulling up. Adventure Paths, gear books, awesome art (NOT gunna happen), monster compendiums... These are the things people want and buy. I'm not saying GURPS can stand in the ring with D&D, but you can still mimic what they do and tailor it to GURPS consumers. GURPS is just so far removed, so very alien to D&D players. Making the jump is more than just learning new rules.

If SJG gave the reins to Piazo's creative minds and said run with it, you'd see something amazingly good come out of it, I'd wager.

Bwahahahaha!

Interestingly, a lot of innovation experts have said this sort of thing is exactly what a company should NOT do. If you're just doing what everyone else does, nothing you do is special.

I think the move to e-books was a good forward-thinking move. With the kind of niche product that a lot of gaming books are, it makes sense. I wish there was some way to get more publicity for e23, though. It is so easy to use e23, and so much is sold through it (and even the material that was not produced at SJG I imagine they get a little something for selling it through e23) that it would be a win-win to make as many people aware of it as possible. Facebook? Linkedin? Disturbing but funny video clips on YouTube? I just don't know...

Rather than fight the "tabletop rpgs are dying" trend, I might try to take advantage of it. More and more people are moving to online rpgs? And it is getting harder and harder to find people in your own area who play GURPS? And not enough people hear about GURPS to begin with? Okay. I have no idea how to do this, or if it is feasible, but maybe there should be some attention to "How can we help people form online gaming groups that recreate as much as possible the tabletop experience?"

Here's a bare bones approach that might work...wouldn't a webcam conference call, where the webcam would let everyone see miniatures, maps, how dice were rolled, the expressions on people's faces, etc. be at least a passable substitute to a face-to-face game? I'd personally prefer face-to-face, because I like being with my friends, but if this was the only way I could play, it wouldn't be so bad. The forums already include ways to have a play-by-forum game...maybe a play-by-conference-call forum (or something better and just easy to do) is the next step?

Any thoughts on all this?

Mark

whswhs · 05-08-2011, 07:35 PM

Let me state my position on this. Next year I'm going to start up my new cycle of campaigns. Almost certainly some of them will be GURPS; it could be all of them. In every previous cycle, I've invited in at least one new player; I've already talked to a couple of people who might qualify for such invitations. That is, I personally try to add new GURPS players to my circle regularly.

Are you doing this? Or anything else personal to recruit new players to GURPS? Because that's your having some skin in this game.

If you don't—if you're just running the same games for the same people you always game with, and not increasing the size of the pool—then it's not obvious to me why Steve Jackson Games should pay much attention to your opinions. Word of mouth is said to be the best of all advertising; so start by advertising them yourself. And if you spot a way they could help you do that, come here and talk about it.

Bill Stoddard

nanoboy · 05-08-2011, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Steve-...es/13976629462 ? ... the fan page.

-or-

http://www.facebook.com/sjgames ? ... the official page ... this one had stuff posted as recently as May 8th. Which would be today. :)

Apparently, I added the wrong page. These didn't pop up in my search (no clue why.)

Qoltar · 05-08-2011, 08:01 PM

Oh Bull*BLEEP* ....I mean, um 'targ-poop' on the negativity.

You want to change things for the better?

Try to get more people to try GURPS and to play GURPS.

I'm doing my part, are YOU?

Want to know more?:
http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=79539

- Ed C.

nanoboy · 05-08-2011, 08:15 PM

I'll certainly be doing my part in the future. Currently, I'm running a Dresden Files RPG campaign, and it's fun and all, but when it's done, if my group wants to play something else that I GM, I'll do my best to sell them on something in GURPS. Hopefully, it will work out.

~~Figleaf23~~ · 05-08-2011, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dgrm4

I have some marketing experience as a business owner. SJG is not marketing Gurps to new customers, only to existing customers. This is the death nail in a product line. I am not joking about this. If you want your beloved game to survive then all of you and ME need to make some SERIOUS NOISE and get SJG attention!

In fairness, I think there is some validity to this warning. The whole industry has been so battered by the consumer exodus to computer-based gaming that survival has depended on getting more revenue from a core base of customers. Ideal strategy would be to stabilize, retrench and then seek growth again.

I certainly think it's right to acknowledge and pursue neew media distibution.

Nemi3e · 05-08-2011, 09:15 PM

GURPS dying?

I disagree, but of course, I'd like to see it on the shelves a bit more. The problem being that it doesn't sell as well as some other stuff. D&D is the lion in the room, yadda yadda.

But you know what I'd like to see on the shelves? A Compiled Dungeon Fantasy Hardcover right next to the D&D books. (Or soft cover, I'm partial to softcovers myself but hardcovers look better)

Luke Bunyip · 05-08-2011, 10:24 PM

What Bill said: go recruit new players. I am gobsmacked by the amount of time that SJGames employees spend promoting product at playtests in FLGS and conventions. Yep, most of those are for things other than GURPS, but once they are in the door, some of those people are going to cross over to the 3d6 side. Run some 'one-offs' in your local FLGS. I recommend 'Exit 23' and 'Double or Nothing'.

That's how I approach it. My nearest FLGS is 1.5 hours away, so I need to recruit by word of mouth. But I have a 'one-off' coming up soon at a friend's house. Some of the players are new, and some are former players of mine. And when I recruit someone, I don't say role playing game, I say interactive improvised theater. It seems to work...

And as for our hobby collapsing, I like GURPS. I plan on playing it for a while. Like my eighty five year old mother that plays Bridge twice a week, when I get to her age, I am planning on playing GURPS. Might even influence which nursing home I end up in about 30 years.

We shouldn't compete with video games, because it is a different experience. And GURPS is one of the better rule sets out there when it comes to running games in a face to face format. Remember we have the social interaction that you don't get with sitting at home in front of your flat screen. I know that some 'horses will not drink when we bring them to water', so it is requisite for us to go out and whisper to the ones which will.

My two cents worth.

panton41 · 05-08-2011, 10:57 PM

For what it's worth I've had the impression that GURPS is doing about as well as it always has in its position within the industry, just that the industry has shrunk and changed so much.

Arguably D&D has always been "top dog" and will probably remain there for the foreseeable future. White Wolf has seemed to be in the #2 position at least as long as I've been gaming. And everyone else shares the remainder.

Arguably GURPS has been the best selling of the "generic" titles, but that's always been a niche and not a very big one.

05-08-2011, 07:35 PM	#33
whswhs Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Lawrence, KS	Re: Gurps is dying a slow death Let me state my position on this. Next year I'm going to start up my new cycle of campaigns. Almost certainly some of them will be GURPS; it could be all of them. In every previous cycle, I've invited in at least one new player; I've already talked to a couple of people who might qualify for such invitations. That is, I personally try to add new GURPS players to my circle regularly. Are you doing this? Or anything else personal to recruit new players to GURPS? Because that's your having some skin in this game. If you don't—if you're just running the same games for the same people you always game with, and not increasing the size of the pool—then it's not obvious to me why Steve Jackson Games should pay much attention to your opinions. Word of mouth is said to be the best of all advertising; so start by advertising them yourself. And if you spot a way they could help you do that, come here and talk about it. Bill Stoddard

05-08-2011, 08:01 PM	#35
Qoltar Pike's Pique Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Cincinnati, Ohio U.S.A.	Re: Gurps is dying a slow death Oh BullBLEEP ....I mean, um 'targ-poop' on the negativity. You want to change things for the better? Try to get more people to try GURPS and to play GURPS. I'm doing my part, are YOU? Want to know more?: http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=79539 - Ed C. __________________ Take me out to the black Tell them I ain't comin' back Burn the land and boil the sea You can't take the sky from me.... A vote for charity: http://s3.silent-tower.org/TheKlingonVotes/index.html

05-08-2011, 08:15 PM	#36
nanoboy Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Edmond, OK	Re: Gurps is dying a slow death I'll certainly be doing my part in the future. Currently, I'm running a Dresden Files RPG campaign, and it's fun and all, but when it's done, if my group wants to play something else that I GM, I'll do my best to sell them on something in GURPS. Hopefully, it will work out.

05-08-2011, 09:15 PM	#38
Nemi3e Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: NYC	Re: Gurps is dying a slow death GURPS dying? I disagree, but of course, I'd like to see it on the shelves a bit more. The problem being that it doesn't sell as well as some other stuff. D&D is the lion in the room, yadda yadda. But you know what I'd like to see on the shelves? A Compiled Dungeon Fantasy Hardcover right next to the D&D books. (Or soft cover, I'm partial to softcovers myself but hardcovers look better) __________________ -- The GM is not your Enemy. The GM is your dealer. Last edited by Nemi3e; 05-08-2011 at 09:35 PM.

05-08-2011, 10:24 PM	#39
Luke Bunyip Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: The Kingdom of Insignificance	Re: Gurps is dying a slow death What Bill said: go recruit new players. I am gobsmacked by the amount of time that SJGames employees spend promoting product at playtests in FLGS and conventions. Yep, most of those are for things other than GURPS, but once they are in the door, some of those people are going to cross over to the 3d6 side. Run some 'one-offs' in your local FLGS. I recommend 'Exit 23' and 'Double or Nothing'. That's how I approach it. My nearest FLGS is 1.5 hours away, so I need to recruit by word of mouth. But I have a 'one-off' coming up soon at a friend's house. Some of the players are new, and some are former players of mine. And when I recruit someone, I don't say role playing game, I say interactive improvised theater. It seems to work... And as for our hobby collapsing, I like GURPS. I plan on playing it for a while. Like my eighty five year old mother that plays Bridge twice a week, when I get to her age, I am planning on playing GURPS. Might even influence which nursing home I end up in about 30 years. We shouldn't compete with video games, because it is a different experience. And GURPS is one of the better rule sets out there when it comes to running games in a face to face format. Remember we have the social interaction that you don't get with sitting at home in front of your flat screen. I know that some 'horses will not drink when we bring them to water', so it is requisite for us to go out and whisper to the ones which will. My two cents worth. __________________ It's all very well to be told to act my age, but I've never been this old before...