06-11-2022, 02:48 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Aug 2018
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Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
M126's "Lend Spell" only works on those which are "maintainable" which basically rules out Missile/Melee since they don't have a duration or a 'to maintain' cost.
I thought of one possible workaround though, and that's using M128's Hang Spell on a missile spell because Hang Spell is maintainble, so if you did "Hang Fireball" you might be able to "Lend Hung Fireball" to your ally? Hang Spell requires Delay which requires Magery 3 though, so I think you could only lend hung missile spells to allies who had magery 3 or more? Same with Reflex since that also has Delay as prereq. Makes me wonder if there are any spells that could temporarily bestow magery for allies for a short period of time so they could accept a hung missile. Presumably if your Magery dropped below 3 while maintaining a spell that has Magery 3 as a prereq you would no longer be able to maintain it. I'm not sure if that means the spell would immediately end, or if it would last whatever duration you'd paid for and then you just couldn't pay the maintenance cost to get a renewed duration? That kinda thing would matter a lot for those w/ switchable magery since the effect of switching off your magery on spell durations/maintainability would need to be known |
06-11-2022, 03:52 PM | #2 | ||
Join Date: Sep 2011
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Re: Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
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06-11-2022, 09:23 PM | #3 | ||
Join Date: Aug 2018
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Re: Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
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If for example I want to target a mage who has Hang Spell > Armor cast, I can't cast Steal Spell to target Armor itself to directly get DR (resisted by their skill in Armor) but instead target Hang Spell (resisted by their skill in Hang Spell) to steal that, which if successful gives me the option to Concentrate 1 second to then get Armor. Quote:
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06-12-2022, 05:38 AM | #4 | |
Join Date: Sep 2011
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Re: Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
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Lend Spell can't affect the subject spell of Hang Spell as that violates Hang Spell's own prohibition on lending hung spells. If you can target the Hang Spell with Lend Spell, then the only manipulations you can make to Hang Spell are those that don't affect the subject spell in any way. As an example, you couldn't decide when a hung fireball is actually cast, rendering Lend Spell's effect on Hang Spell moot as far as manipulating Hang Spell goes. |
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06-12-2022, 07:07 PM | #5 | |||||
Join Date: Aug 2018
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Re: Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
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Now you have me thinking about stuff like "can I cast Hang Spell on Hang Spell?" Something like "I cast Hang Spell at 10 energy so when I use a Concentrate I can initiate a hanging of any spell costing 10 energy or less!" ? Quote:
Hang Spell is a different spell then the spell it is acting upon. Basically you can't directly lend a spell you haven't activated yet (and nobody can steal it from you) but there's no prohibition against doing that to Hang Spell itself I can see. The big difference here is that Steal Spell has to defeat Hang Spell in a quick contest to steal Hang Spell. You can't bypass it to Steal Spell from the hung spell directly. Quote:
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Instead of you being the one who chooses to Concentrate to activate your Hung Fireball, by using Lend Spell, you are designating the Lendee as the new chooser who may opt to Concentrate to cast that spell. You could not, however, just force the fireball to appear in your ally's hand. M128 discusses the use of Suspend Spell, an interesting question here is whether you would be casting Suspend Spell on Hang Spell or whether you would be casting it on the Hung Spell which Hang Spell is hanging. |
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06-12-2022, 08:34 PM | #6 | |||
Join Date: Sep 2011
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Re: Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
Then you can't cast Lend Spell of Hang Spell until after Hang Spell has the subject spell attached to it, since Hang Spell says they have to to be cast immediately and with no delays between the castings.
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06-13-2022, 12:46 AM | #7 | ||||
Join Date: Aug 2018
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Re: Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
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By the time you get around to using Lend Spell (or Steal Spell) to target Hang Spell, it's already past the tether point. When you are the owner of Hang Spell I'm pretty sure you don't get the option to ditch whatever spell is currently hung on it and hang a 2nd alternate spell on it without recasting - you're stuck with whatever spell you 1st hung on it. - - A useful comparison to this might be if you tried to cast Steal Spell on something like Spellguard - you would steal the Spellguard but not the spell it was guarding. What do you think the effect of that would be, like if you would get to specify a new spell for it to guard? Normally being the owner of a Spellguard doesn't give you the ability to switch it to guard a different spell on the fly though... It seems like maybe it would continue to guard the spell which it was originally guarding (you could not change that) but you could do things like opt to cancel the Spellguard early before it's duration ended, so that you could attack the spell w/ stuff like Counterspell more easily. Quote:
The term "hung spell" to me refers to the ongoing effect of maintaining Hang Spell, which is to anchor portents of a partially-cast spell that hasn't actually been completely cast. It is not "activated" to use the adjective M128 uses. The 'activation' causes the spell roll to occur. Like Spellguard, this is a spell you cast on another spell which is the "subject". Quote:
If you use Lend Spell to take something like Hang Spell, you could hang onto that indefinitely and never activate it, terminate it prematurely, let the duration elapse without maintaining, etc. Fireball isn't being targeted because it's not actually "on". If Fireball were "on" then you couldn't cast spells at all and you'd have a big ball of fire in your hand. "A hung spell counts as one spell “on” (p. 10) for casting purposes" seems to me to be referring to "Hang Spell" itself being on, performing it's purpose (hanging onto an unactivated spell after the time/energy were spent) |
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06-13-2022, 01:49 AM | #8 |
Join Date: Sep 2011
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Re: Lending a Fireball to an ally? Maintaining Magery 3 spells w/ Magery 2
I don't think that I can contribute anything further to this as we now seem to be in the position of reiterating arguments already made and answered.
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Tags |
hang spell, lend spell, magery, maintain spell, meta-spells |
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