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Old 09-22-2020, 02:07 PM   #11
AlexanderHowl
 
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Default Re: Rearranging the setting.

If you have an interstellar object traveling at 300 km/s, perhaps kicked out of a system by gravitational interaction with a neutron star, could cross 50 AU in ten months. If it was a M-class asteroid with a density of 8 grams per cubic centimeter and a radius of 10 km, it would possess 1.5 YJ of kinetic energy (three times as the KT extinction). The THS civilization might be capable of detecting the object a decade out and might be capable of deflecting the object. It would probably require a minimum of 10% of global GDP for a decade to be able to deflect the object though.

Now, the above scenario would be fascinating in the THS scenario because there are significant numbers of people who live off the Earth who might not care and, in the case of the Duncanites, might see it as an opportunity to finally destroy their statist enemies. In addition, digital intelligence might not support the sacrifices required to save biological life on Earth, as they can easily leave the Earth. In fact, they might push for uploading as an 'affordable' alternative to deflecting the object, and they might actively resist efforts to deflect the object as an unnecessary expense.
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Old 09-22-2020, 02:51 PM   #12
johndallman
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Default Re: Rearranging the setting.

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If you have an interstellar object traveling at 300 km/s, perhaps kicked out of a system by gravitational interaction with a neutron star, could cross 50 AU in ten months. If it was a M-class asteroid with a density of 8 grams per cubic centimeter and a radius of 10 km, it would possess 1.5 YJ of kinetic energy (three times as the KT extinction). The THS civilization might be capable of detecting the object a decade out and might be capable of deflecting the object. It would probably require a minimum of 10% of global GDP for a decade to be able to deflect the object though.
I don't think it's quite that hard. A 100MT hydrogen or antimatter bomb releases 0.4TJ of energy, and the space navies of the THS setting can deliver quite a few of those. The deflection angle required is quite small, if you deliver your attack at any significant distance from Earth.
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. . . in the case of the Duncanites, might see it as an opportunity to finally destroy their statist enemies.
They might well hope for it. But if they do anything active, they're taking their society's existence in their hands. If they try and fail, they will be exterminated.
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In addition, digital intelligence might not support the sacrifices required to save biological life on Earth, as they can easily leave the Earth. In fact, they might push for uploading as an 'affordable' alternative to deflecting the object, and they might actively resist efforts to deflect the object as an unnecessary expense.
The sheer amount of manufacturing capability that remains on Earth makes this a poor argument. You're massively increasing the number of infomorphs in the solar system, while accepting the destruction of most of the computer R&D and manufacturing capability.
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Old 09-23-2020, 04:51 AM   #13
Phil Masters
 
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Default Re: Rearranging the setting.

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Now, the above scenario would be fascinating in the THS scenario because there are significant numbers of people who live off the Earth who might not care and, in the case of the Duncanites, might see it as an opportunity to finally destroy their statist enemies.
Some younger and more hot-headed ones might talk big on that subject, but I suspect that the older, smarter, or more economically or culturally literate ones would then roll their eyes and issue a few ten-minute lectures on reality. The Duncanite communities in canon-TS just aren't that large or, really, economically or culturally independent. They trade with the inner system, and I'm sure that a lot of their imports include Bollywood movies, K-pop, intensive slinkie experiences of terran environments, and the latest novels - as well as terrabytes of scientific research and new tech designs to pirate. It'd be like an American frontiersman in 1850 wishing for Washington and New York to be destroyed.

I'm sure they'd love to have the "statist sheeple" off their necks sometimes, but that's not the same as wanting most of the human race to die. Subtract Earth, and the Duncanites (and other spacers) are living perpetually on the edge, with no one to trade with and a lot fewer new ideas to "borrow". Anyhow, much more fun to provide space engineering advice on the deflection project (for a fair fee) and then gloat about it for the next five or ten or two hundred years.
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Old 09-23-2020, 06:35 PM   #14
the-red-scare
 
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Default Re: Rearranging the setting.

One alternate THS setting I’ve toyed with is basically keeping everything the same except not having SAIs and uploading. Keeping the bioroids, parahumans, swarms, LAIs/NAIs all over the place, but in this universe either safetech concerns or some quantum whatever makes infomorphs rare or nonexistent. If LAIs sort of fill any SAI NPC roles, there aren’t THAT many differences, but the PCs have to be meat.

I think (with no evidence) most PCs are meat anyway, so maybe it doesn’t matter.
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Old 09-24-2020, 02:31 AM   #15
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Default Re: Rearranging the setting.

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If LAIs sort of fill any SAI NPC roles, there aren’t THAT many differences, but the PCs have to be meat.
LAIs as written are fundamentally rather playable.

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I think (with no evidence) most PCs are meat anyway, so maybe it doesn’t matter.
In the two campaigns I've seen, probably 40%-50% PCs were infomorphs of some kind. IIRC other people's campaigns also tend to have the number hover at the 20%-60% values.
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Old 09-24-2020, 03:32 AM   #16
johndallman
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In the two campaigns I've seen, probably 40%-50% PCs were infomorphs of some kind. IIRC other people's campaigns also tend to have the number hover at the 20%-60% values.
  • Standard of the Man (Vacuum Cleaners): Five PCs: three humans, one SAI and one ghost/fragment (I never found out the details).
  • Europe on Mars (Consular special operations): Fluctuated, but the three core PCs were a human, a bioroid and an SAI.
  • QRA (Royal Navy): Five PCs: one parahuman, two upgraded humans, one SAI and one ghost. Two NPCs: one upgraded human and one ghost.

Last edited by johndallman; 09-24-2020 at 11:53 AM.
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Old 09-24-2020, 06:59 AM   #17
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Default Re: Rearranging the setting.

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one ghost/fragment (I never found out the details)
Somewhere in the space between shadow and fragment, but with a stronger belief in its own identity than most.

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three humans
There are probably people who care about the difference between humans and parahumans.
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Old 09-24-2020, 11:54 AM   #18
johndallman
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There are probably people who care about the difference between humans and parahumans.
True, edited.
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Old 09-25-2020, 05:45 AM   #19
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Default Re: Rearranging the setting.

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In the two campaigns I've seen, probably 40%-50% PCs were infomorphs of some kind. IIRC other people's campaigns also tend to have the number hover at the 20%-60% values.
I've run two Transhuman Space campaigns, and no one ever chose to play an infomorph. Well, unless you count the one character who was a ghost rather than an AI, and occupying a bioshell cloned from his own former body. No AIs at all.
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Old 09-25-2020, 06:36 AM   #20
vicky_molokh
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I've run two Transhuman Space campaigns, and no one ever chose to play an infomorph. Well, unless you count the one character who was a ghost rather than an AI, and occupying a bioshell cloned from his own former body. No AIs at all.
Infomorph is a category that includes Ghosts, Fragments, Shadows, and all AIs in Transhuman Space AFAIK.

(Now, the spiritual successor Eclipse Phase uses the term very differently, denoting state rather than essence, but I'm not sure why an EP-like exclusion of ghost-hosted-by-bioshell be in play.)
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