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Old 11-16-2018, 02:31 AM   #21
a humble lich
 
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

In 3.5 the Mark of Making at low level gave repair spells like Make Whole or Mending. Im not sure of an official advantage to magically repair nonliving items, but you could give them something like Healing(Non-living items only +0%). Alternately, you could let them cast Repair as an innate spell, but I think having the Dragonmarks as advantages gives them a nice contrast to the spell system.
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Old 11-16-2018, 03:20 AM   #22
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

Yeah, I always thought that Dragonmarks were a cool concept, but they were let down by the D&D spellcasting system - which made them generally inferior to "true" spellcasters.

By turning them into Powers they can be interesting and unique in their own right.
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Old 11-16-2018, 02:56 PM   #23
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

Mark of making: It really depends on what you want to accomplish, but things like quick gadgeteer, dungeaon alchemist(from DF), gizmos(and enchanted variants of it, I have some in: https://hups.kivinen.iki.fi/k2011:advantages#gizmo ), snatcher, create can be possible powers for it. And obviously the heal/repair things.
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Old 11-16-2018, 03:04 PM   #24
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert View Post
Yeah, I always thought that Dragonmarks were a cool concept, but they were let down by the D&D spellcasting system - which made them generally inferior to "true" spellcasters.

By turning them into Powers they can be interesting and unique in their own right.
I think the bigger cause of the let down is the class and level system. The Dragonmarks were implemented as feats, so the granted abilities had to be balanced with feats.

I agree that building the granted powers as powers could make them interesting. Keith Baker has suggested many times that Dragonmarks are much more important in the world than the spell like ability. The thing that makes the Dragonmarked Houses powerful is the talent and ability to use focus items that the Dragonmarks grant. He has also suggested that sorcerers could use Dragonmarks as their source of magic and that many spells could have been developed by studying the effects of Dragonmarks.

In addition to Create, I would suggest Control for Mark of Making powers. I would avoid too many destructive abilities for "True" Dragonmarks since they are supposed to be constructive. Aberrant Dragonmarks are usually destructive rather than constructive. It is your Eberron, so you can make the decisions. Also demolition could be considered constructive because it makes room for new construction.
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Old 11-16-2018, 10:57 PM   #25
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

While I was asleep, one of the players became fretful about whether it was possible to build a proper Artificer using the GURPS rules and expressed this via email. However, he only knows the 3E rules, so I tried to reassure him that the 4E rules allowed for a lot more flexibility.

Nethertheless, coming up with rules for Artificers should probably have priority right now. Here is one possibility for expressing Artificer inventions:


Artificer Gear

Modular Ability (Cosmic, Combination of Breakable and Can Be Stolen worth -20%, Magical -10%, Physical Only +50%, Preparation Required (One Hour) -50%) , Requires Skill Roll (Engineering (Magical)) -10%): 6/level

Artificers can use Extra Effort (see GURPS Powers, p. 160) to increase their level of Modular Ability. This costs 1 FP and -1 to the Engineering (Magical) skill roll per +5% to the Modular Ability level, to a maximum of +100%.


EDIT: Oh, and where precisely do the GURPS rule say that you can use a skill roll instead of an attribute roll for Requires (Attribute) Roll from GURPS Powers? I know that the expanded GURPS Psionics rules use this, but where is this from?
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Last edited by Jürgen Hubert; 11-16-2018 at 11:00 PM.
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Old 11-17-2018, 12:31 AM   #26
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

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Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert View Post
Oh, and where precisely do the GURPS rule say that you can use a skill roll instead of an attribute roll for Requires (Attribute) Roll from GURPS Powers? I know that the expanded GURPS Psionics rules use this, but where is this from?
GURPS Psionics gets it from the "Skills for Everyone" sidebar in GURPS Powers on page 162.
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Old 11-17-2018, 01:15 AM   #27
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

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Originally Posted by a humble lich View Post
GURPS Psionics gets it from the "Skills for Everyone" sidebar in GURPS Powers on page 162.
Thanks!

Another question: I am sure that I have seen official rules for "magical engineers" before, but where?
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Old 11-17-2018, 01:34 AM   #28
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

Further questions:

- Is there anything wrong with the idea: "The Gadgeteering rules can be used to build magical items at the cost it would normally require to enchant an item, but in far shorter time"?

- B474 says: "The facilities required to build a prototype cost $50,000 if the invention is Simple, $100,000 if Average, $250,000 if Complex, or $500,000 if Amazing." Are there any rules for adjusting this for the base TL/wealth level of the campaign? I mean, I would rate Eberron as TL3+2, but even then the costs seem to be more appropriate for a modern-day campaign...
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Old 11-17-2018, 06:28 AM   #29
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert View Post
Further questions:

- Is there anything wrong with the idea: "The Gadgeteering rules can be used to build magical items at the cost it would normally require to enchant an item, but in far shorter time"?

- B474 says: "The facilities required to build a prototype cost $50,000 if the invention is Simple, $100,000 if Average, $250,000 if Complex, or $500,000 if Amazing." Are there any rules for adjusting this for the base TL/wealth level of the campaign? I mean, I would rate Eberron as TL3+2, but even then the costs seem to be more appropriate for a modern-day campaign...
Since arcane magic is a science in Eberron, I don't see a problem with Gadgeteering being used to create magic items. I would look at Metatronic Generators in Pyramid 3/46. It is a system for building super science gadgets from advantages using Gadgeteering. It should be able to adapt it to magic fairly easily. Christopher Rice may have suggestions on his blog. I know he has adapted it to RPM.

The Enraged Eggplant has a Metatronic Enchanting system https://enragedeggplant.blogspot.com...nchanting.html

On the same page it also says that the cost doesn't scale with TL and suggests using a wealthy Patron to allow use of facilities. House Cannith sounds like a good source of Patrons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert View Post
Thanks!

Another question: I am sure that I have seen official rules for "magical engineers" before, but where?
Dungeon Fantasy 11 has the Spellsmith Power-Up for Artificers. There might be something in a Technomancer supplement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jürgen Hubert View Post
While I was asleep, one of the players became fretful about whether it was possible to build a proper Artificer using the GURPS rules and expressed this via email. However, he only knows the 3E rules, so I tried to reassure him that the 4E rules allowed for a lot more flexibility.

Nethertheless, coming up with rules for Artificers should probably have priority right now. Here is one possibility for expressing Artificer inventions:


Artificer Gear

Modular Ability (Cosmic, Combination of Breakable and Can Be Stolen worth -20%, Magical -10%, Physical Only +50%, Preparation Required (One Hour) -50%) , Requires Skill Roll (Engineering (Magical)) -10%): 6/level

Artificers can use Extra Effort (see GURPS Powers, p. 160) to increase their level of Modular Ability. This costs 1 FP and -1 to the Engineering (Magical) skill roll per +5% to the Modular Ability level, to a maximum of +100%.


EDIT: Oh, and where precisely do the GURPS rule say that you can use a skill roll instead of an attribute roll for Requires (Attribute) Roll from GURPS Powers? I know that the expanded GURPS Psionics rules use this, but where is this from?
The Modular Ability could work. I would also look at RPKs Cosmic Gadget Pool for ideas if you want to go with a Gadget Pool. http://www.mygurps.com/r_gadgetpool.html

I would go with Affliction(HT; Advantage, <some meta-trait> +x%; Melee Attack, C -30%; Magical -10%; Costs 1 FP -5%; Cast on equipment +?) [varies]. I am not sure if cast on equipment would be a cosmic or +0% feature. You might also want to alter the duration.

You could also do Affliction(HT; Advantage, Affliction(HT; Advantage, <some meta-trait> +x%; Melee Attack, C -30%; Magical -10%; Costs 1 FP -5%); Melee Attack, C -30%; Magical -10%; Costs 1 FP -5%) [varies], but that could get confusing.

a humble lich already gave an answer about Rolls for Everyone.

Last edited by calmquist; 11-17-2018 at 06:32 AM.
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Old 11-17-2018, 07:57 PM   #30
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Default Re: GURPS Eberron, Redux

My previous suggestion involving some sort of Cosmic or an Affliction granting Affliction are too complicated. I have much simpler solution demonstrated with two worked examples of Artificer Infusions converted below.

Some Infusions like Bull's Strength, are modeled well by afflicting an Advantage with a built in Gadget Limitation. This may seem sort of strange, but I know of no rule prohibiting it. It also fits the how the Artificer Infusions work, so I don't see a problem.

Bull's Strength: Affliction(HT; Advantage, Belt of Bull's Strength, +30%; Costs 1 FP, -5%, Melee Attack, C, -30%; Magical, -10%) [9] Note: "Belt of Bull's Strength" is Increased Lifting and Striking ST 1 (Gadget, DR 2 (-20%); SM-3 (-15%); must be forcibly removed (-10%); Magical, -10%) [3]

Other Infusions change the properties of the item being affected like Reinforced Armor (an example of the Magic Vestment Infusion) are modeled as afflicting the item directly.

Reinforced Armor: Affliction(HT; Accessibility, Only on armor, -20%; Advantage, Reinforced Armor, +260%; Magical, -10%; Costs 1 FP, -5%; Melee Attack, C, -30%) [30] Notes: “Reinforced Armor” is 26 points, per Enhances or Transforms an Existing Attack (GURPS Thaumatology - Sorcery, p. 11). Each additional level removes -2 in penalties [+16]. This spell is based on the Reinforce Armor imbuement skill from Pyramid #3-4.

In both cases, the Artificer is creating a temporary magical item or magical effect on an item. Increasing the level of the meta-traits is fairly simple and is left as an exercise for the reader.

Credit goes to Enraged Eggplant for the Reinforced Armor notes and Belt Gadget modifier.
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