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Old 05-26-2013, 12:09 PM   #31
Sunrunners_Fire
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Bullhead City, AZ
Default Re: Power Stone Price

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
Status 2 for a secondary/journeyman Enchnter is excessive. He's not a "business leader". His Master/Head of the Enchantment Circle might be. He might only be Staus 1 and it's the Guildmaster of Enchnters who's stauts 2.
Its' either a privileged profession or it doesn't exist. There are too many other things a potential enchanter could be doing that would give a faster and better return on its' investment (and that of the people who are paying to support the mage while it is being trained). Like, say, the Earth College. Essential Earth is a lovely spell. Take Earth to Stone as well ... and you're a walking talking adamant/orichalcum mine. IQ 10 + Magery 2 means you're spending nearly seven months learning the necessary spells to a reasonable level rather than having to invest the four years necessary to become even an apprentice enchanter.

Spend a tad bit more than a year (total), and you can grab Purify Earth as well which does wonders for your desirability.

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
Remember, Status 0 is not an actual average of how the population lives at TL3. It's a game mechanical norm. That secondary Enchanter with a rare-ish but not earthshaking talent might well take a job supporting "only" Status 0 when the alternatives were Status =2 serf or Status -1 poor citizen.
The vast majority of the rural population are Status -2, with the vast majority of the urban population being Status -1.

I don't expect you are going to run into very many rural enchanters to begin with.
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Old 05-26-2013, 12:19 PM   #32
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: Power Stone Price

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The vast majority of the rural population are Status -2, with the vast majority of the urban population being Status -1.
.....and if even apprentice Enchanter is a ticket out of the "vast majority" it looks quite good at Stotus 0.

The guys making the armor might not even be Mages. They could be Dwarven Priests of the Great God KlannG! and ignoring all those prereqs. They also might be living at Status 0 too because Dwarves are tight-fisted and other dwarves living ostentatiously gain negative Reputations. Truly resected Dwarves get "free" Status from Rank or have personal reps as Great Craftsmen.
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Old 05-26-2013, 12:24 PM   #33
Sunrunners_Fire
 
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Default Re: Power Stone Price

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
.....and if even apprentice Enchanter is a ticket out of the "vast majority" it looks quite good at Stotus 0.

The guys making the armor might not even be Mages. They could be Dwarven Priests of the Great God KlannG! and ignoring all those prereqs. They also might be living at Status 0 too because Dwarves are tight-fisted and other dwarves living ostentatiously gain negative Reputations. Truly resected Dwarves get "free" Status from Rank or have personal reps as Great Craftsmen.
To which the response is, "I see you've taken option C and changed how enchanting works. Sounds good."
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Old 05-26-2013, 12:30 PM   #34
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Default Re: Power Stone Price

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To which the response is, "I see you've taken option C and changed how enchanting works. Sounds good."
I don't see how the enchanting rules can mesh with the actual spells and other Gurps rules without creating an unworkable mess.
Something needs to be altered.
Many of the spells are so powerful as to require mages be quite rare to avoid dominating the setting. But the enchanting rules assume they are as common as dirt eking out a modest living despite enormous intelligence, skill, and power.
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Old 05-26-2013, 12:35 PM   #35
Sunrunners_Fire
 
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Default Re: Power Stone Price

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I don't see how the enchanting rules can mesh with the actual spells and other Gurps rules without creating an unworkable mess.
Something needs to be altered.
Many of the spells are so powerful as to require mages be quite rare to avoid dominating the setting. But the enchanting rules assume they are as common as dirt eking out a modest living despite enormous intelligence, skill, and power.
GURPS isn't an economics simulation engine. At best, it provides a gameable abstraction. It doesn't actually care about such things; its' an action-adventure game engine that is flexible enough to model (with varying degrees of success) other genres and styles.
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Old 05-26-2013, 12:48 PM   #36
Fred Brackin
 
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To which the response is, "I see you've taken option C and changed how enchanting works. Sounds good."
No I haven't. Clerical Magic is a longstanding option in Gurps Magic. It's just one you weren't paying attention to. Like Q&D and piece meal Enchantment of armor.
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Old 05-26-2013, 01:11 PM   #37
Sunrunners_Fire
 
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Default Re: Power Stone Price

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No I haven't. Clerical Magic is a longstanding option in Gurps Magic. It's just one you weren't paying attention to. Like Q&D and piece meal Enchantment of armor.
Clerical Magic is based on Power Investiture. I've been talking about mages, not priests. Priests don't get a choice as to what magic they receive from their gods; mages do get a choice as to what magic they learn how to cast. Q&D Enchantment and Piece-Meal Enchantment for Armor Enchantments simply aren't relevant. For a mage to desire becoming an enchanter, enchanting must be more rewarding than the other comparable options. At best, Q&D and Piece-Meal broaden the customer base by lowering the per-item price. At worst, Q&D and Piece-Meal make it less desirable for a mage to become an enchanter due to reducing the per-item price. I consider the effects of such to be a wash and so didn't engage on the sub-topic.

My statement is, "Why would a mage want to be an enchanter?" Your statements have been, "Here is how you make enchantments cheaper to buy." *shrugs* Cheaper enchantments merely means that you have to sell more of them a month in order to maintain your income. And if you don't sell more, you start to think of doing something else with your time that actually rewards you.
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Old 05-26-2013, 01:58 PM   #38
Anthony
 
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Default Re: Power Stone Price

Enchantment rules in GURPS have the distinction of being the only type of crafting that actually provides rules for doing it. If it were being properly redone rather than an ancient legacy system it would just be "enchantment X costs $Y" and then you can use the gadgeteering rules for adventuring enchanters.
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Old 05-26-2013, 02:29 PM   #39
Flyndaran
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Default Re: Power Stone Price

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Enchantment rules in GURPS have the distinction of being the only type of crafting that actually provides rules for doing it. If it were being properly redone rather than an ancient legacy system it would just be "enchantment X costs $Y" and then you can use the gadgeteering rules for adventuring enchanters.
Low Tech companions have some rules for crafting. The problem is simply the absurdly long time assumed to craft even minor magic items.
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Old 05-26-2013, 04:41 PM   #40
Anthony
 
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Default Re: Power Stone Price

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Low Tech companions have some rules for crafting. The problem is simply the absurdly long time assumed to craft even minor magic items.
The base objective of the enchantment system in GURPS Magic is "PCs should never do enchantment". Thus, it was made extremely unappealing. The time requirements aren't necessarily bad, it's just that the skill and prerequisite requirements for enchantment are unduly high.
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