07-11-2018, 10:09 AM | #11 |
GURPS Line Editor
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
The plausible minimum for me is probably three skills:
Which has nothing to do with the heroes of adventures, of course. Those are generally not only interesting people, but also exceptional ones. Even a "pure combat monster" in fantasy will want a Melee Weapon skill and Shield; Knife for backup; a ranged combat skill; Fast-Draw for their melee weapon, knife, and/or ammo; and unarmed striking and grappling skills. That's seven to nine skills just for violence, and their friends will likely insist that they also take Climbing, Hiking, and Stealth so they're not a liability. Now we're up to 10-12 skills, and the GM might be unwilling to accept the character if there's no context, be that Armoury for a mercenary who has to look after his own gear, Leadership and/or Tactics for a captain, or Riding and Savoir-Faire for a knight. Call it a dozen skills. The Dungeon Fantasy Roleplaying game offers a good case study. That game has a greatly condensed skill list relative to GURPS. Even so, discounting spells, the 15 pregenerated characters for it have 17-31 skills apiece, with 22 skills being the mean and median, and one of the modes. So heroes are going to be boasting close to two-dozen skills even in narrowly focused campaigns such as those featuring little but dungeon crawls. I'd expect even higher numbers for broad-focus campaigns where the PCs must be self-reliant and ready for anything: Age of Sail explorers, modern-day commandos or spies, futuristic space crew, etc.
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Sean "Dr. Kromm" Punch <kromm@sjgames.com> GURPS Line Editor, Steve Jackson Games My DreamWidth [Just GURPS News] |
07-11-2018, 10:36 AM | #12 | |||
Join Date: Feb 2005
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
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Few people I’ve encountered know who their city councilmen or aldermen are, few know who their state legislators are, a few might know federal legislators or what district they are in. Very few know any alternate route from their work to their house, even when several exist. Navigation would imply being able to navigate other places than where you live... most people get around by going places they ha e already been, taking the same street, riding the same train... that’s not navigation. If they are really good at it and know all the lines and so on it might be a point in area knowledge. Now, all that said I like my characters to have a broad experience so I usually do have many one and two point skills, but the average real life person doesn’t. Whether characters should depends on the flavor of the game... There was another thread or post somewhere about “critical skills” or some such that every character should have for emergencies: fast talk, escape, forced entry + some others. I like that idea but I always require that a player justify out of character skills or abilities. How did your librarian learn to kick in doors? I should also add that the games I played or run in GURPS seem low powered compared to many described here. We usually play at the 150 point level and occasionally 250. Attributes over 14 require unusual background, and we use the book definition of skill levels: 12 is some training or talented beginner, 14 is federal agent level firearms skill (which we take to mean someone who often might have to shoot somebody for a living), and 18 as the best shooter of a generation. the skill levels rarely exceed 16 and never 18 so far... usually 15-16 for main combat skills and 14 ish for supporting skills and 12-10 for hobby and background skills. A recent college graduate with a BS is Chemistry probably has Chemistry 12, Physics-10, and Mathematics ((Applied)-10. Quote:
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Last edited by tanksoldier; 07-11-2018 at 11:05 AM. |
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07-11-2018, 10:59 AM | #13 | |
Hero of Democracy
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: far from the ocean
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
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I compared Action to this. Its templates have 14 to 25 skills, with 19 as the median and one of the two modes... but they also have 20 points set aside for lenses, and at least half of those are likely to be spent on points. Monster hunters ranges from 19 to 30 skills, with 24 as the average and the median. (there is some variability in here, but not too much).
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07-11-2018, 11:28 AM | #14 | |
GURPS Line Editor
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
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I can find less to back up my argument in broad-focus campaigns, but in my secret-agents game, the range was 31-48 skills, the mean was 41, and the median was 45. I'd say "three to four dozen skills" would be fair there. I wouldn't call any of these figures a "minimum" in the usual sense. Still, when I'm the GM, these figures would establish a cutoff below which I'd start looking more closely at the character to see whether the player had sacrificed skills to load up on attributes, advantages, and all the rest. I'd certainly have a lot of trouble with a dungeon delver who had only around 10 skills, or a supposed international man of mystery with maybe 20. Part of this, of course, is because a good skill base is an important part of what makes a hero more than just a cog, like the lesser fortune-seekers and troubleshooters they're called in to replace, and like the generic opposition they face in droves.
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Sean "Dr. Kromm" Punch <kromm@sjgames.com> GURPS Line Editor, Steve Jackson Games My DreamWidth [Just GURPS News] |
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07-11-2018, 12:33 PM | #15 | ||
Banned
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 100 hurricane swamp
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
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For me, I go skill heavy. My Characters, and my Player's Characters tend cover a lot of bases, because we don't want to be rolling at default. Our Characters are Big Damn Heroes, and BDH don't flub simple tasks because they are rolling at defaults*. * Unless they want to fail for humour sake or other reasons. Quote:
We're BDH and we require Big Damn Skills. I couldn't agree more. |
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07-11-2018, 12:49 PM | #16 |
Join Date: Oct 2014
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
About Computer Operations, with the number of PEBCAKs, Layer 8 and ID10T errors I've been called to fix, I believe most people who operate computers use the skill at Default.
I just happen to have a high IQ and thus a higher default than most people, hence why I pass for a computer expert among my family despite knowing next to nothing about computers. In the land of the blind, the one eyed man is king. |
07-11-2018, 04:43 PM | #17 |
Join Date: Oct 2008
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
I do not know about "minimum", but campaign style and point definitely matters a great deal. There is a huge difference between a low point short game and long running high point game.
In my long running fantasy game player characters currently have 210-252 skills each... But I have run campaigns where the characters have only about a dozen skills. That large number of skills in the current campaign is the result of having quite many points(3206-3567), long running campaign(311 sessions now) and fairly low attribute caps. That has caused them to try to have at least one point in each skill they may have to use as defaults are fairly low and the points and time to get them. |
07-11-2018, 04:54 PM | #18 | |
Join Date: Oct 2008
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
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One of the reasons why it is no longer a core business is because the average computer user in a company is a LOT better at doing normal basic things. Some of it is that computers have gotten somewhat easier to use, but a lot of it is that most users actually can do basic troubleshooting, installation and such tasks fairly well. They do not really usually know why they are doing the things they are doing and they definitely are taking extra time and such, but that is what skill 10 is after all(average human with one point in computer operation), it does not make you professional in it. |
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07-11-2018, 05:13 PM | #19 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Wellington, NZ
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
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These days, I'm running a game that's gone from 150-point characters to 350-400 points for a new character and the PCs still in play from the early days run at 1000-1150 points. The number of skills ranges from 66 on the lowest point character (470 points, 136 in skills) to 90-100 for the higher point characters (with a mean of ~6 points per skill). The players still run into situations where their characters are lacking skills they want them to have.
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Rupert Boleyn "A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history." |
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07-11-2018, 05:32 PM | #20 | |
Join Date: Mar 2013
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Re: Minimum Skill Count
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