[Horror] Sketchy Setting & Some Monsters

[Dangerious P. Cats]

I really like the name Sodom for the hellworld. I think it captures the general feelings of sexual discomfort that typifies the whole thing. The tortured angles being damaged in ways that make people feel uncomfortable to look at (the way people feel squeamish when they see a injury or medical procedure), the worm things that take control of someone by penetrating them, it's all very sub-conscious uncomfortable, and somewhat sexual.

[vicky_molokh]

BTW, why keep only ONE hell-city? Why not have Nod for murder, Roma Inferna for betrayal, Sodom for abstinence, Hiroshima for crimes of war, Gulags for blind ideological fanaticism etc.? Keep the landscape diverse, and include a greater variety of sins compared to what Judeo-Christian religions include - as per examples.

[Classic Uncle Sam]

Mentioned that perhaps the PCs enter this world through dreams. You could also add those who have had near death experiences - really flat lining on the table, etc - because it makes people spiritually linked to this demented purgatory. I keep thinking of the movie Flatliners. You probably don't want your players individuals who've played around with death..but perhaps one or two of them have.

In fact, the world could really be purgatory. Forever in drab limbo is quite a bad spot to be in. Perhaps all those souls who could never pass on went a little mad and then something else happened..to bring about the horror of it all.

[Max Schreck]

Originally Posted by Molokh

The sexual connotations seem to be known here too.

Ah, I see. I stand corrected then. Where you come from, does the term "sodomite" designate a zoophiliac or a practitioner of anal sex? The way I understand it, "sodomite" is used in the U.S., especially in religious circles, to denote either a homosexual or a practitioner of anal sex in general. Where I'm from (Denmark), "sodomite" exclusively means a denizen of Sodom, where of course various alternative sexual practices were performed, hence the American usage, I guess. "Sodomy" in Denmark means zoophilia, also derived from the alleged sexual practices of the wicked city. It was not until I met Americans that I discovered that "sodomy" could also mean anal sex. Phew! What a tangent!

Blushing Max

[Max Schreck]

Originally Posted by ClayDowling

How about Nineveh? A massive historical city, is was at one point in the Bible mentioned as an Evil city. They repented of their sin, but then fell. They are supposedly the vast plain of ruins west of modern Mosul.

Perhaps too historical for my purposes. I don't want any confusion as to the otherworldly nature of this place, and that it is not a real, physical location, but rather a state of mind or somesuch. Sodom, while not a perfect name in any sense, is free of "real" historical connotations, and is at the same time heavily laden with mythic connotations of wickedness and sexual depravity, which is kind of what I'm gunning for.

Originally Posted by vitruvian

If we're going Biblical, than is this dreamland not the very land of Nod in which Cain settled?

The term "Land of Nod" has unfortunately been used quite extensively in pop culture, including WW's WoD, which also has Cain in a rather central role. I don't want to be too derivative. It is unfortunate, though, as the "Land of Nod" both means land of sleep and is a Biblical reference. It just screams out to be used, but alas we are not the first to think so.

Originally Posted by Dangerious P. Cats

I really like the name Sodom for the hellworld. I think it captures the general feelings of sexual discomfort that typifies the whole thing. The tortured angles being damaged in ways that make people feel uncomfortable to look at (the way people feel squeamish when they see a injury or medical procedure), the worm things that take control of someone by penetrating them, it's all very sub-conscious uncomfortable, and somewhat sexual.

Those were actually some of the themes I had in mind when I brainstormed this embryonic setting. I still don't think Sodom is a perfect name, but it conjures some unappealing images in my mind.

Max

[Max Schreck]

Originally Posted by Tinman

This looks interesting. At this juncture I have nothing to add except my support and interest. You always have good horror posts, Max. Thanks.

No, no, thank you. Thank you kindly. I'll admit that in recent years I have been more and more exclusively drawn to creating horror campaigns. It's been years since I ran anything fantasy-like, and my SF campaigns always seem to smuggle something horrific and atrocious into play. I blame comics, subversive movies and the modern educational system. All of them undermine decent society.

Max

[Max Schreck]

Originally Posted by tantric

It doesn't have to be about God. For example, when the Buddha had reached enlightenment and was being challenged by Lord Mara, the god of illusions, Mara caused all the armies of Hell to line the horizons and fire flaming arrows. The Buddha smiled, and as the arrows approached him, they turned to flower petals. As a devout Buddhist, I would firmly expect to be able to perform the Bhūmisparśa mudrā - ie, point to the ground with my right index finger while saying "The Earth is my witness" - and repel any number of demons. And, dammit, it's about time that worked in a modern horror movie!

What I'm saying is that True Faith, though it should be tailored to each religion, really doesn't have to rely on the existence of an external power.

Ah, yes, tantric, you hit it on the head with that post. You reminded me why True Faith absolutely has to go. I am aiming for a universe where the reality of various religions of the world is subjective, whereas True Faith is pretty much objective proof that religion, whether or not it professes some supreme transcendental being, we can call God, or whether or not true enlightenment comes from within by realizing the futility of existence and leaving the great chain of being, works and is objectively real. And if that is so, how do my fictitious creatures fit into that cosmology?
A horror campaign already deals with "the supernatural". By stating that True Faith (Buddhism) works against my Torture Angels, I am also implicitly stating that my setting takes place in a universe, where Buddhism is objectively true in that it works against these creatures. Same goes for theistic religions. If saying the Lord's Prayer makes demons go away, I will have defined who is top boss in this universe. And if both of them work, why is that so?

Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc

Maybe not an anthromorphized external power, but it does imply the existence of spiritual forces in the setting that IMHO need to be well-defined in the GM's head up front if they have meaningful IC effects.

Couldn't have said it better (or shorter, as you can see). True Faith pre-supposes an objective "true cosmology", which isn't something I have calculated into my still-embryonic setting. I'll have to think about it.

Max

[vicky_molokh]

Sodomy seems to be a somewhat archaic reference to anal, usually male-male sex.

Regarding True Faith:
As someone said before, settings that allow for multiple true faiths usually place faith itself above any 'supernatural entities'. Basically it sets the sapient mind as the ultimate power - this mind can be weak or powerful, benevolent or corrupt, smart or dumb . . . But one should never underestimate its Ultimate Potential for power.

[Max Schreck]

Originally Posted by Opellulo

Continuing the pillage upon Kult i think you can borrow some of its great ideas to work out True Faith: GOD (or whatever is in charge) is dead (or has left) so any form of religious belief is strong only because "believing in something" works as an anchor preventing you to shift in reality towards Sodom.

So any form of "strong belief" could save you, not only religious one but also more mundane "faiths" like: Patriotism, Family, Science, Greater Good and so on. IIRC in Kult having a code of honor is an advantage and not a disvantage becuse it "eases" your way to see the world.

Another "village ready to pillage" is an old underrated PC game: "Omikron: the Nomad Soul", it has a wonderful story of daemons, split realities, superior powers and... David Bowie!

Your definition of True Faith is very much in line with the official GURPS definition. True Faith seems to work for all religions, as it relies on the strength of your convictions, rather than any objective reality those convictions might have. That's all well and good, but I think in this particular case it would detract from the setting's "flavour". As Molokh asked earlier: will any religion do? How about Jedis or Satanists?
I must admit, I would have a hard time maintaining a proper atmosphere if a Star Wars crazy (I mean, is following some tenets you saw in a science fantasy movie really a real religion?) or an Anton LeVey-wannabe were able to repel demons. Just my thoughts on the matter.

As for the pillaging, I think I have already pillaged as much from Kult as it will bear. Any more, especially specific details from the Kult cosmology like the sudden absence of God, and I might as well make a GURPS Kult conversion, rather than trying to cobble together my own setting, which admittedly steals liberally from various sources. I must say, though, that the Silent Hill game series was more what I had in mind, when I thought up the first ideas for this setting. Kult and Silent Hill has several overlapping themes, though, so it's hard to say from where I stole what.

Max

[Max Schreck]

Originally Posted by Molokh

BTW, why keep only ONE hell-city? Why not have Nod for murder, Roma Inferna for betrayal, Sodom for abstinence, Hiroshima for crimes of war, Gulags for blind ideological fanaticism etc.? Keep the landscape diverse, and include a greater variety of sins compared to what Judeo-Christian religions include - as per examples.

Good eye, Molokh, good eye! I have actually been toying with a similar idea: maybe this "otherworld" that the unfortunate protagonists go to is actually a multiverse of unpleasant alternate realities. A sort of "IW of Horror", if you will. Maybe these various realities touch upon each other, and you can travel from one to the other. Maybe they could be connected by certain themes, like the layers and circles in Dante's "Inferno". Arrrrghhh! That would mean that I would have to come up with a name for the multiverse itself, as Sodom (as it seems to be stuck being called for now) would then only be one shard of a whole mass. Not only that, I would also have to come up with the names (not to mention themes) of all the other "horror worlds".
But great idea, nonetheless.

Originally Posted by Molokh

Regarding True Faith:
As someone said before, settings that allow for multiple true faiths usually place faith itself above any 'supernatural entities'. Basically it sets the sapient mind as the ultimate power - this mind can be weak or powerful, benevolent or corrupt, smart or dumb . . . But one should never underestimate its Ultimate Potential for power.

Yeah, I replied to Opellulo even as you posted. As I said, this also seems to the official GURPS definition. I'm just not very happy with it for this campaign setting.

Max