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Old 09-30-2018, 01:56 PM   #11
Kromm
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

This supplement is part of the GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters sub-series, so it's strictly focused on NPC foes. It does not talk about dragons as PCs, mostly because DF has an "us vs. them" boundary and dragons are very much "them" . . . but also because they're huge and wouldn't fit into most dungeons (making them boring PCs), and because a lot of the abilities are established by fiat (and would have wonky point costs).

Mana Hoarder isn't here, but nothing says dragons can't have power items.
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Old 09-30-2018, 03:53 PM   #12
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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It does not talk about dragons as PCs, mostly because DF has an "us vs. them" boundary and dragons are very much "them" . . .
Wonder whether "half dragon" is a good choice to put in the inevitable Extra Races supplement.

Of course if you're desperate GURPS Dragons is dual-statted for both 3rd AND 4th.
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Old 09-30-2018, 05:55 PM   #13
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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Wonder whether "half dragon" is a good choice to put in the inevitable Extra Races supplement.

Of course if you're desperate GURPS Dragons is dual-statted for both 3rd AND 4th.
There's a template for a DF dragon PC in Pyramid #3/72, along with PC versions of a few other monsters.
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Old 09-30-2018, 06:48 PM   #14
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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There's a template for a DF dragon PC in Pyramid #3/72, along with PC versions of a few other monsters.
Can Monsters 4 but used as some sort of power-up guide for the dragon template in #3/72?
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Old 09-30-2018, 06:52 PM   #15
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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Can Monsters 4 but used as some sort of power-up guide for the dragon template in #3/72?
I haven't read DFM4 yet, but I suspect it'd work best as inspiration rather than a guide to a specific progression.
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Old 09-30-2018, 11:26 PM   #16
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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Can Monsters 4 but used as some sort of power-up guide for the dragon template in #3/72?
Monsters 4 doesn't use point costs as it is a strictly NPC related volume. Having said that, if you want to use it as such in your own games, you can do so. You would have to group them into bite-size pieces on your own though.

I have a couple of blog posts planned in stating those abilities. But I'm still reading through it and working on the review so the first of those are at least a week or two out.
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Old 10-01-2018, 01:44 AM   #17
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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I haven't read DFM4 yet, but I suspect it'd work best as inspiration rather than a guide to a specific progression.
This is correct in my opinion. As Kromm pointed out, the powers are not detailed with point costs. Still, they can serve as inspiration for delvers.
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Old 10-01-2018, 05:19 AM   #18
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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There's a template for a DF dragon PC in Pyramid #3/72, along with PC versions of a few other monsters.
Oh, cool. Thanks!
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Old 10-01-2018, 07:35 AM   #19
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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Wonder whether "half dragon" is a good choice to put in the inevitable Extra Races supplement.
People tend to overlook that there's a dragon-blooded race on p. 15 of GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 3: The Next Level (2008), which has access to power-ups that turn them into mini-dragons, described on pp. 39-40 of GURPS Dungeon Fantasy 11: Power-Ups (2010).

Despite the tools existing for 8-10 years, I haven't seen a lot of powered-up dragon-blooded warriors discussed as PCs on these forums. My guess is that the point cost to be a strong, naturally armored, fire-breathing adventurer with impaling teeth and claws is regarded as being too high. That's probably because most of the benefits can be emulated for cash by buying weapons and armor . . . which highlights why monster races aren't always optimal PC races.
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Old 10-01-2018, 08:56 AM   #20
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Default Re: GURPS Dungeon Fantasy Monsters 4: Dragons

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Despite the tools existing for 8-10 years, I haven't seen a lot of powered-up dragon-blooded warriors discussed as PCs on these forums.
Might be because it requires two different products. And in my experience people can be kind of lazy tracking down existing options they don't already have.
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