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Old 04-18-2013, 03:34 PM   #1
hcobb
 
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Default Shockwaves deadly underwater

An underwater Ogre has no defense against a cruise missile and a cruise missile that detonates in its hex removes that Ogre, correct?
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Old 04-18-2013, 05:20 PM   #2
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
An underwater Ogre has no defense against a cruise missile and a cruise missile that detonates in its hex removes that Ogre, correct?
Correct. See 10.04 in the 6e rules:
Quote:
... Remove all units, buildings, etc., in the hex it strikes. Place a crater market in that hex, unless it is in a lake or river.
See also 7.14.4, regarding Water effects on combat:
Quote:
An Ogre or Superheavy submerged in a water hex may not attack. It may be attacked only by a ram by another such unit, and overrun by Marines, or by (all at half strength) Howitzers, Mobile Howitzers, and Ogre missiles. It can also be affected by Cruise Missiles (see 10.04).
Edit for completeness: More of 10.04:
Quote:
Terrain may protect units outside the explosion hex. ... If [a unit] is in a town hex, or underwater, treat it as being two hexes farther away.
So, an Ogre underwater in an adjacent hex suffers a 1-2 against each component, and an Ogre underwater further away suffers no effect.

Edit again: "two hexes farther away", not a two-column shift. The orange text above is wrong.

Last edited by KevinR; 04-18-2013 at 05:38 PM.
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Old 04-18-2013, 05:30 PM   #3
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

dont know. the whole water boundary layer thing seems to present some interesting questions in my pea sized brain. if 'nothing' is available to either intercept, redirect, or in-ert a nuke, my best 'guess' is that the target is going to vaporize in proximity to the warhead.

on the other hand, if a counternuke, explosion, boundary layer or pressure effect is present to either sop up most of the heat or pressure wave, then i would imagine some kind of a defense is possible.

then we have the 'hyperspeed' effect of some of the newer underwater missiles/torpeedies to consider...

thats why i like my supersize ekranoplan ogre transports. faster, stealthy, and can mount some lasers, or cloned howard cosell acoustic defense batteries.
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Old 04-18-2013, 05:52 PM   #4
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

On land Ogres should only suffer from shockwave effects if a SB accidentally sets off the bomb. Otherwise the cruise missile (fired from 9 hexes away) takes the MB and SB shots and then goes and parks on the Ogre. (Giving AP a 12+ interception roll would of course fix this.)

Ogre survival table on land:
Mark I: 17% survival (111% average payoff from 3 AU crawler)
Mark II: 42% survival (154% payoff)
Mark III: 79% survival (119% payoff)
Fencer: 81% survival (139% payoff)
etc...
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Old 09-12-2013, 04:46 PM   #5
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
On land Ogres should only suffer from shockwave effects if a SB accidentally sets off the bomb. Otherwise the cruise missile (fired from 9 hexes away) takes the MB and SB shots and then goes and parks on the Ogre. (Giving AP a 12+ interception roll would of course fix this.)

Ogre survival table on land:
Mark I: 17% survival (111% average payoff from 3 AU crawler)
Mark II: 42% survival (154% payoff)
Mark III: 79% survival (119% payoff)
Fencer: 81% survival (139% payoff)
etc...
it surprises me that ap isnt given some kind of interception chance for everything. it would bog the game down considerably, but i wonder if defending units 'in range' of target units could use their armament/ap to add 'defense' to the target. an 'iron dome' if you will ?

allowing your units to 'defend' against attacks from an ogre/missle/other unit in lieu of attacking...?
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Old 09-13-2013, 09:51 AM   #6
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmoredYak View Post
it surprises me that ap isnt given some kind of interception chance for everything. it would bog the game down considerably, but i wonder if defending units 'in range' of target units could use their armament/ap to add 'defense' to the target. an 'iron dome' if you will ?

allowing your units to 'defend' against attacks from an ogre/missle/other unit in lieu of attacking...?
I believe the ability of the AP to intercept incoming attacks is abstracted into every Ogre component's defense value.
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Old 09-13-2013, 10:49 AM   #7
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyborgmutant View Post
I believe the ability of the AP to intercept incoming attacks is abstracted into every Ogre component's defense value.
Yeah, except against cruise missiles. Both logically and game play wize this would help. Missile flingers would actually shockwave Ogres instead of simply all-or-nothing nuking them as is optimal now.
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Old 09-13-2013, 11:54 AM   #8
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArmoredYak View Post
thats why i like my supersize ekranoplan ogre transports. faster, stealthy, and can mount some lasers, or cloned howard cosell acoustic defense batteries.
Sorry, Howard Cosell acoustic weapon systems were declared inhumane in 1995 and permanently deactivated.
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Old 09-13-2013, 12:42 PM   #9
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

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Originally Posted by al_kenobi View Post
Sorry, Howard Cosell acoustic weapon systems were declared inhumane in 1995 and permanently deactivated.
bummer, the billion miniature clones i have in my stasis chamber will have to wait until i can find a way to abrogate the foolish treaty. a few well placed bribes, and this crime can progress.
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Old 09-13-2013, 12:44 PM   #10
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Default Re: Shockwaves deadly underwater

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
Yeah, except against cruise missiles. Both logically and game play wize this would help. Missile flingers would actually shockwave Ogres instead of simply all-or-nothing nuking them as is optimal now.
optional rule?
units can forego their attack to use 1/2 of their capability as defensive fire, if within range of functional .....command posts...? or something?
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