Ground pressure of OGRE tanks...

[Toltrin]

So I was looking ground pressure of all the vehicles:
M-1 Abrams?
136,000 lbs / 9855 in² = 13.8 psi
Assault Battlesuit?
1,792 lbs / 130 in² = 13.8 psi (16 inch x 8 inch footprint)
Infantryman, unarmored, full kit?
230 lbs / 60.5 in² = 13.8 psi (12 inch x 6 inch footprint)
OGRES?
OGRE Mark 3 : 246 psi
OGRE Mark 5 : 232 psi (surprisingly)
There might be a problem of them even traveling on open ground with ground pressure like that.........

[Misplaced Buckeye]

Originally Posted by Toltrin

So I was looking ground pressure of all the vehicles:
M-1 Abrams?
136,000 lbs / 9855 in² = 13.8 psi
Assault Battlesuit?
1,792 lbs / 130 in² = 13.8 psi (16 inch x 8 inch footprint)
Infantryman, unarmored, full kit?
230 lbs / 60.5 in² = 13.8 psi (12 inch x 6 inch footprint)
OGRES?
OGRE Mark 3 : 246 psi
OGRE Mark 5 : 232 psi (surprisingly)
There might be a problem of them even traveling on open ground with ground pressure like that.........

Doubtful. Armstrong flooring did an ad almost 2 decades ago stating that a full grown Bull African Elephant has a ground pressure of 240. On the other hand a 5'5" 120lb woman in 4 inch heels with the cap missing off her heels exerts 10, 000 psi which would scratch boiler plate. It's all about the distribution.

[TheAmishStig]

Originally Posted by Misplaced Buckeye

Doubtful. Armstrong flooring did an ad almost 2 decades ago stating that a full grown Bull African Elephant has a ground pressure of 240. On the other hand a 5'5" 120lb woman in 4 inch heels with the cap missing off her heels exerts 10, 000 psi which would scratch boiler plate. It's all about the distribution.

Small world. I work out of what used to be the Armstrong Flooring world headquarters. When they built a bigger one across town, the old one became an office building.

[dwalend]

Originally Posted by Toltrin

So I was looking ground pressure of all the vehicles:
M-1 Abrams?
136,000 lbs / 9855 in² = 13.8 psi
Assault Battlesuit?
1,792 lbs / 130 in² = 13.8 psi (16 inch x 8 inch footprint)
Infantryman, unarmored, full kit?
230 lbs / 60.5 in² = 13.8 psi (12 inch x 6 inch footprint)
OGRES?
OGRE Mark 3 : 246 psi
OGRE Mark 5 : 232 psi (surprisingly)

What do you base your numbers on for ogre mass and footprint?

[TexPoec]

I recall (from decades ago) reading in an Avalon Hill rulebook, maybe PanzerBlitz that a man and a tank from the period had about the same PSI. It also said that PSI determined mobility - they implied they factored such when deciding movement rates, etc.

The only Ogre weights I know come from GURPS and I am not sure about them. I noticed recently that the Paneuro light tank weighs 70+ tons! That is a pretty big main battle tank by today's standard. Before, I had assumed the Heavy was essentially a smart MBT but weighs more, again from GURPS.

[ColBosch]

When people talk about how GURPS Ogre is iffy canon-wise, it's primarily about the GURPS Vehicle stats. I wouldn't use those for any sort of analysis.

[Toltrin]

Originally Posted by ColBosch

When people talk about how GURPS Ogre is iffy canon-wise, it's primarily about the GURPS Vehicle stats. I wouldn't use those for any sort of analysis.

Yeah - I used GURPs data. Hrm.

[Tim Kauffman]

...BPC...what does it weigh? There is the handwavium which makes OGREs possible

[ColBosch]

Originally Posted by Toltrin

Yeah - I used GURPs data. Hrm.

Do whatever you want to, of course. :-) But I just don't think that GURPS Vehicles was a good fit for Ogre. Mr. Woodward did his best, but creating near-future, gigantic, intelligent, armored vehicles that can not only survive but outright ignore direct hits from nuclear warheads without superscience like force fields is beyond the scope of the system. But, that was what the author had to work with, so it's what we got.

For example, the Ogre Mk. I was supposed to be air-transportable with conventional aircraft. At 1.5 million pounds, that absolutely beggars belief - it has to weigh less. Other issues are that the Ninja weighs more than a Mk. V, and the Fencer weighs less than a Mk. III.

[TheAmishStig]

Originally Posted by ColBosch

Do whatever you want to, of course. :-) But I just don't think that GURPS Vehicles was a good fit for Ogre. Mr. Woodward did his best, but creating near-future, gigantic, intelligent, armored vehicles that can not only survive but outright ignore direct hits from nuclear warheads without superscience like force fields is beyond the scope of the system. But, that was what the author had to work with, so it's what we got.

For example, the Ogre Mk. I was supposed to be air-transportable with conventional aircraft. At 1.5 million pounds, that absolutely beggars belief - it has to weigh less. Other issues are that the Ninja weighs more than a Mk. V, and the Fencer weighs less than a Mk. III.

For perspective: The C5M, one of the meatiest cargo planes currently in service, can can haul roughly 460,000lbs.

Running lazy napkin math based on the M1A2 and Winchell's size chart...(Mk.I length / M1A2 length)^3 * M1A2 Weight...it comes out closer to 610,000lbs. But I can't stress enough how lazy that math is, it's a starting point / sanity check, not an authoritative answer.

We would still have to factor for things like BPC vs conventional armor, how much of the increased scale is "BPC is [X] times lighter, slather it on [X] times thicker!", the weight of engine + fuel vs a reactor, and that the designers didn't take an M1A1, input "Scale: 1.646" into their design computer, save it as "Mk1.3ds", and break for an early lunch.