[Mass Combat] [Fantasy] The King's Two Bodies and Mass Combat

[vicky_molokh]

Greetings, all!

I think this is my third thread regarding The King's Two Bodies (F128). This time, I'm interested in how it would work in the context of mass combat - primarily as a factor that influences battle. Because really, this trait is really useful in such a large-scale military campaign, where it should make a difference on a major scale.

How should the mass combat resolution be altered if it is lead by such a Blessed commander? What about if it is merely one of the many armies kingdom? What if the True King is not commanding the army, but only a part of it? Etc. etc.

Thanks in advance!

[vicky_molokh]

Sorry for the bump, but this issue is likely to come up in one form or another in my campaign, possibly as soon as the nearest Saturday. Any answers?

[Brandy]

Originally Posted by Molokh

Greetings, all!

I think this is my third thread regarding The King's Two Bodies (F128). This time, I'm interested in how it would work in the context of mass combat - primarily as a factor that influences battle. Because really, this trait is really useful in such a large-scale military campaign, where it should make a difference on a major scale.

How should the mass combat resolution be altered if it is lead by such a Blessed commander? What about if it is merely one of the many armies kingdom? What if the True King is not commanding the army, but only a part of it? Etc. etc.

Thanks in advance!

I don't see how it would have any impact at all. The blessing works by analogy and metaphor, and works both ways. If the armies of the king are defeated and thus the country will fall the king will take ill -- but the country can not *truly* fall until his death.

I don't think it should provide any tactical advantage whatsoever. Why do you think that it should?

[The Benj]

Yeah, I wouldn't give it a mechanical bonus, just a narrative one. You'll always have another chance to save the kingdom as long as you've saved the King.
And vice versa.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Bookman

I don't see how it would have any impact at all. The blessing works by analogy and metaphor, and works both ways. If the armies of the king are defeated and thus the country will fall the king will take ill -- but the country can not *truly* fall until his death.

I don't think it should provide any tactical advantage whatsoever. Why do you think that it should?

Well, here are some possible interactions:

• Being a mage of Destiny, the 'king' (more like, 'destined warlord') can afflict himself with Daredevil, Serendipity and/or Luck.
• Being a 175-point character, he can take part in the combat itself (with or without commanding any units). This can either be abstracted to Heroism rolls (how would their effects change?) or be played out.
• It should be noted that while half the army are Fanatical, and one of their goals is making sure he stays alive. So if he gets to leave the regional theatre of battle, the army should probably get some bonus to Retreat.
• . . . Aaaand, while the army is ready to follow his orders if he shows himself ready (it's more likely that he'll only get to command 1-4 of its 10 Elements), he might be unwilling to have anything to do with it. For all I know, he could end up using the army's clash with another army as an opportunity to get off the island without being found by either one of the two armies (the other army is out to get him, but he doesn't know it yet).

[Brandy]

I'm sorry; maybe I'm confused. I don't see what any of those has to do with "The King's Two Bodies."

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Molokh

Greetings, all!

I think this is my third thread regarding The King's Two Bodies (F128). This time, I'm interested in how it would work in the context of mass combat - primarily as a factor that influences battle. Because really, this trait is really useful in such a large-scale military campaign, where it should make a difference on a major scale.

How should the mass combat resolution be altered if it is lead by such a Blessed commander? What about if it is merely one of the many armies kingdom? What if the True King is not commanding the army, but only a part of it? Etc. etc.

Thanks in advance!

He does not have to wait for a report to know when the kingdom is being attacked. The advantage of not having to wait days or weeks for word of trouble on the border, being able to start mobilising troops right then and there is considerable. You could also probably get a noticeable bang for your buck out of casting a buff spell on the king.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

He does not have to wait for a report to know when the kingdom is being attacked. The advantage of not having to wait days or weeks for word of trouble on the border, being able to start mobilising troops right then and there is considerable. You could also probably get a noticeable bang for your buck out of casting a buff spell on the king.

Which is exactly the sort of things I'm asking about. Basically, tKTB was designed to be used in campaigns involving massive-scale events, such as in Mass Combat. But the mechanics are missing. Perhaps somebody knows a good variant (e.g. those involved in the playtest)?

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Molokh

Which is exactly the sort of things I'm asking about. Basically, tKTB was designed to be used in campaigns involving massive-scale events, such as in Mass Combat. But the mechanics are missing. Perhaps somebody knows a good variant (e.g. those involved in the playtest)?

It wasn't discussed in that way in the playtest. And if you read GURPS Fantasy's chapter on warfare (the latter half of Chapter 8), you'll see that it gives little attention to this advantage, if any.

Really, The King's Two Bodies reflects almost the antithesis of a mass combat approach; it's a conceptual hangover from the archaic personal conception of the state, the kind of thing that shows up in Shakespeare's plays when characters are called "France" or "Burgundy."

In practical terms, The King's Two Bodies is primarily a substitute for divination and oracles. What the king feels and suffers reflects what his kingdom feels and suffers; and with an IQ roll, you (or the king himself) could interpret the geopolitical events that that suffering mirrors. Treat it as an information source. An invading army might register as no more than an itch or a creepy feeling, as if an ant were crawling on you, until it started actually to destroy things or kill people. At that point, the king might be able to tell his knights, "I feel trouble in the northern mountains; take two companies and go so what's happening there."

Other than that, you'd need to be careful to keep the king safe. If he's ill, or wounded, or crippled, your chances of winning a war plummet. On the other hand, he could make himself an offered sacrifice, putting himself in danger so that his life was in the hands of the gods, so that his kingdom could be saved for his heir.

The kind of pragmatic thinking you're trying to do is poles apart from the logic of this trait.

Bill Stoddard

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by whswhs

It wasn't discussed in that way in the playtest. And if you read GURPS Fantasy's chapter on warfare (the latter half of Chapter 8), you'll see that it gives little attention to this advantage, if any.

Really, The King's Two Bodies reflects almost the antithesis of a mass combat approach; it's a conceptual hangover from the archaic personal conception of the state, the kind of thing that shows up in Shakespeare's plays when characters are called "France" or "Burgundy."

In practical terms, The King's Two Bodies is primarily a substitute for divination and oracles. What the king feels and suffers reflects what his kingdom feels and suffers; and with an IQ roll, you (or the king himself) could interpret the geopolitical events that that suffering mirrors. Treat it as an information source. An invading army might register as no more than an itch or a creepy feeling, as if an ant were crawling on you, until it started actually to destroy things or kill people. At that point, the king might be able to tell his knights, "I feel trouble in the northern mountains; take two companies and go so what's happening there."

Other than that, you'd need to be careful to keep the king safe. If he's ill, or wounded, or crippled, your chances of winning a war plummet. On the other hand, he could make himself an offered sacrifice, putting himself in danger so that his life was in the hands of the gods, so that his kingdom could be saved for his heir.

The kind of pragmatic thinking you're trying to do is poles apart from the logic of this trait.

Bill Stoddard

Grumble grumble.

I was hoping to find some trait that would bring meaningful Destiny-themed benefits on a strategic scale. I'm quite surprised it's not the case, given the description of the trait.