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Old 01-17-2021, 03:34 PM   #31
dcarson
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

A non-RAW solution might be to put a cap on defaults. I can see that you pick up enough to do things from reading and TV and such for easy cases but not when penalties start hitting. So cap defaults to 10-11.
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Old 01-17-2021, 03:51 PM   #32
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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Originally Posted by dcarson View Post
A non-RAW solution might be to put a cap on defaults. I can see that you pick up enough to do things from reading and TV and such for easy cases but not when penalties start hitting. So cap defaults to 10-11.
That's not very different from my proposal to say that raising a stat above 16 doesn't do anything for defaults. That gives you a default of 10-12 depending on how hard the skill is.
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Old 01-17-2021, 10:25 PM   #33
YankeeGamer
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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Originally Posted by Anders View Post
Remember that GURPS is not a reality simulator.
I'm not using the character for a game, but I constantly use GURPS when fleshing out a character for any game system or story. When I'm writing a story, I sometimes roll for a character's success.
Having a semi decent character sheet also lets me look back, thinking "How would she handle this?" both from skills and advantagres/disadvantages. (If she's got a fear of snakes in chapter one, I need to have that noted in chapter seven.

This is the first ultra intelligent character I'm trying to write. (I am reducing will and perception.)

She's basically developing rocketry from scratch starting in 1876, a whiz at math--smart and talented enough to be inventing new things for rocketry when she's only got a few points into it, because she's inventing the science as she goes.
Lots of math talent (the max of +4) plus high IQ, but she also learns languages fast--but puts her foot in her mouth when dealing with "stupid people" in matters of math/science.

I am making sure that she's not a Mary Sue, there are some things that aren't solvable by brains alone.

She's going to end up on a level with Newton or Einstein, or close to it, anyway.

GURPS gets a lot of use from me when building characters or even whole worlds for any story or game system!

EDIT: I do put a "cap" on defaults.
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Old 01-17-2021, 11:08 PM   #34
AlexanderHowl
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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Originally Posted by YankeeGamer View Post
I'm not using the character for a game, but I constantly use GURPS when fleshing out a character for any game system or story. When I'm writing a story, I sometimes roll for a character's success.
Having a semi decent character sheet also lets me look back, thinking "How would she handle this?" both from skills and advantagres/disadvantages. (If she's got a fear of snakes in chapter one, I need to have that noted in chapter seven.

This is the first ultra intelligent character I'm trying to write. (I am reducing will and perception.)

She's basically developing rocketry from scratch starting in 1876, a whiz at math--smart and talented enough to be inventing new things for rocketry when she's only got a few points into it, because she's inventing the science as she goes.
Lots of math talent (the max of +4) plus high IQ, but she also learns languages fast--but puts her foot in her mouth when dealing with "stupid people" in matters of math/science.

I am making sure that she's not a Mary Sue, there are some things that aren't solvable by brains alone.

She's going to end up on a level with Newton or Einstein, or close to it, anyway.

GURPS gets a lot of use from me when building characters or even whole worlds for any story or game system!

EDIT: I do put a "cap" on defaults.
She is a cinematic character, it is a TL5 character doing TL7 science, so why worry about the realism her IQ? The character will need Gadgeteer, phenomenal levels of Wealth, and absurd levels of skill, so IQ 20 would probably be the most realistic part of the character. The character will suffer between a -16 to -18 on her Concept rolls, meaning that she would need a minimum skill of 25 to have a reasonable chance at producing a workable concept and to actually produce a prototype.

Flying the prototype would also be a problem. Since no one can really lear Piloting/TL7 (Aerospace), any pilot would need to learn Piloting/TL5 (LTA) and then default to Piloting/TL7 (Aerospace) at -9 (-5 for the difference in specialties, -2 because of the TL difference, and -2 because of the complexity of the controls). No one with a TL5 background could default Piloting/TL7 (Aerospace) from DX because there is no conceivable way that they are familiar with the basic principle. In essence, both the inventor and the pilot need to be cinematic characters.
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Old 01-17-2021, 11:54 PM   #35
YankeeGamer
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
She is a cinematic character, it is a TL5 character doing TL7 science, so why worry about the realism her IQ? The character will need Gadgeteer, phenomenal levels of Wealth, and absurd levels of skill, so IQ 20 would probably be the most realistic part of the character. The character will suffer between a -16 to -18 on her Concept rolls, meaning that she would need a minimum skill of 25 to have a reasonable chance at producing a workable concept and to actually produce a prototype.

Flying the prototype would also be a problem. Since no one can really lear Piloting/TL7 (Aerospace), any pilot would need to learn Piloting/TL5 (LTA) and then default to Piloting/TL7 (Aerospace) at -9 (-5 for the difference in specialties, -2 because of the TL difference, and -2 because of the complexity of the controls). No one with a TL5 background could default Piloting/TL7 (Aerospace) from DX because there is no conceivable way that they are familiar with the basic principle. In essence, both the inventor and the pilot need to be cinematic characters.
She isn't building liquid fueled moon rockets; she's starting with what is known about rockets, which are old news by this time, and taking them forwards. No one's going to be flying them; they'll be too small and certainly unsafe, but making them more accurate, trying for altitude records, and carrying instruments aloft. The year is right on the cusp of TLs 5 and six.

This is not TL 7 overnight, this is a Newton or Einstein that works with what's available. When liquid oxygen is available, she'll develop the liquid fueled rocket. She also has a patron.
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Old 01-18-2021, 03:01 AM   #36
johndallman
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Cambridge, UK
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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Originally Posted by YankeeGamer View Post
When liquid oxygen is available, she'll develop the liquid fueled rocket.
You need a fuel to burn with LOX. Liquid hydrogen in bulk is TL7, and large-scale oil refining is early 20th century. Alcohols are probably the best bet.
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Old 01-18-2021, 08:08 AM   #37
AlexanderHowl
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

Alcohol with LOX has a horrible ISP. If I remember correctly, the first liquid fuel rockets were gasoline and LOX.
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Old 01-18-2021, 09:06 AM   #38
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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Originally Posted by YankeeGamer View Post
I am making sure that she's not a Mary Sue, there are some things that aren't solvable by brains alone.
GURPS IQ is broader than "brains alone," even if you disregard its effects on Will and Per. With IQ 20, say, you are looking at Savoir-Faire 16, Fast-Talk 15, and Diplomacy 14. There are also the economic skills, such as Merchant 15 and Finance 14, and the military skills of Strategy 14 and Tactics 14.

At the very least, unless you want her to be a really good "face," you need to give her one or more disadvantages that lower her social skills drastically.

It might work better to give her a modestly high IQ, maybe 12 or 13, and then buy the four levels of Mathematical Ability you mentioned. Starting off with 1 point getting her skill 14 in Astronomy, Engineer, Mathematics, and Physics will get her a long way toward having the needed skills. Or you could boost her IQ to 14 and take a less crippling social disadvantage.
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Old 01-18-2021, 11:04 AM   #39
Sam Baughn
 
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Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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Originally Posted by whswhs View Post
And it seems to me that no matter what the power level, letting skills default from a stat higher than 16 (say) is cinematic or epic rather than realistic.
I'd say it's more like stats (except ST, maybe) higher than around 16 are unrealistic for normal humans. Superhuman intelligences very well might be as good as trained professional humans at hundreds of skills; we don't know what something on the far side of genius would be capable of because nothing like that has ever existed. IQ 20 is as much smarter than Newton or Von Neumann as they were to normal people, or a normal person is to a small child or smart animal.
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Old 01-18-2021, 11:20 AM   #40
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Meaning of stats compared to real world

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I'd say it's more like stats (except ST, maybe) higher than around 16 are unrealistic for normal humans. Superhuman intelligences very well might be as good as trained professional humans at hundreds of skills; we don't know what something on the far side of genius would be capable of because nothing like that has ever existed. IQ 20 is as much smarter than Newton or Von Neumann as they were to normal people, or a normal person is to a small child or smart animal.
You can say that if you want. But per the RAW, the upper limit of human stats is 20, not 16.

To be sure, there are different fixes for this. But ever since I came up with the enhancement to stats for GURPS Supers that lets you default from a stat higher than 20 (so an IQ 24 superbeing could have nearly all IQ skills at 18-20, or world class brilliance, as a default), I've liked the idea that normal humans have the symmetric trait of not defaulting from a stat higher than 16.

Either my fix or yours takes us away from RAW, of course.
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