[DF] Will Points... has anyone used them with DF?

[b-dog]

I am thinking about adding Will Points to be the mental analog to Hit Points. It would fit the DF genre well because in DF there is loads of combat and the character need to recoup after major battles in order to accomplish the goal of the defeating the boos bad guy. Now there could also be mental damage from hostile spells, viewing Things Man Was Not Meant to Know, psionic blasts, etc. This could make for a more interesting game IMO. Some spells, exposures and psionics could cause Will Point damage and once it reaches certain levels then the actual Will to resist things becomes reduced until the PC rests or magically repairs his/her Will. So has anyone done this? And if so please tell me what you thought about it because I am considering adding this stat. Thanks.

[tg_ambro]

I always thought the "woo-woo" damage to the spirit was FP based attacks, like the Soul As-Sharak deals, and Fright Checks.

I'm not convinced that this would work well, or is needed, probably because it's not really something I can imagine, or understand what it would do, but I think having it work like HP or FP, with "at 1/3 damage" effects and "below 0" effects would work out better than having it modify existing stats. I'm not sure what would happen at those levels though.

[DukeofDellot]

Will Points... as in Sanity Points?

Since I'm currently playing through Eternal Darkness, I'd be all for it...

But having experience in Call of Cthulhu, I'd likely stay away.

However, if you just want to emulate Mental Fatigue... I usually roll that into FP. Most things that tax me mentally in the real world also make me physically tired, and vice versa. Maybe it's because I'm Fat [-3].

I'd have to agree with Ambro though... maybe something like...

WP is equal to your Will [±1/WP], when you're at 1/3 WP you're Will is broken (1/2 Will) or your mentally taxed (1/2 IQ in general), and when you go below 0 you loose HP in the same way as if your FP was that low.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by DukeofDellot

WP is equal to your Will [±1/WP], when you're at 1/3 WP you're Will is broken (1/2 Will) or your mentally taxed (1/2 IQ in general), and when you go below 0 you loose HP in the same way as if your FP was that low.

I mostly agree, but I would choose different effects for low WP. I'd treat 1/3 WP as an Irritating Condition, similar to Drowsy (-2 DX, IQ, and self-control). Zero WP would result in an Incapacitating Condition, akin to Daze (must Do Nothing, -4 to Active Defense). Negative WP might inflict mental disadvantages that linger even after the "damage" is healed, while -5xWP could cause permanent insanity or equivalently nasty effects.

[Gudiomen]

Originally Posted by tg_ambro

I'm not convinced that this would work well, or is needed, probably because it's not really something I can imagine, or understand what it would do, but I think having it work like HP or FP, with "at 1/3 damage" effects and "below 0" effects would work out better than having it modify existing stats. I'm not sure what would happen at those levels though.

As a psychologist I see a direct correlation between Will Point loss and stress. 1/3 WP and 0 WP can be treated as advanced, aggravated levels of stress.

Recovery rate should be slow, slower than HP, and only REALLY significante things should cause the loss of Will Points. Loosing over WP/2 in a single instance would probably cause a nervous breakdown (psychotic episode, or trigger some pathology until the WPs recover, like panic syndrome, for instance).

Mechanically being bellow 1/3 WP should probably halve Will, IQ and Per resistance rolls, and at 0 WP you halve them again.

Psychotherapy would have the same effect as a physician on HP recovery, and psychopharmaceuticals would cancel the effect of low WP while they're used (with the appropriate side-effects and dependency issues, in some cases).

You can go to town on this. Just don't use it in a campaign where you routinely have to deal with stressful situations and don't want to deal with the long term psychological effects. It's more appropriate for horror games, or gritty realistic games, where the cop cares less and less and eventually starts to drink, his family life goes down the drain, or goes crooked because the department won't give him the proper conditions to work with and his boss as crazy as he'll eventually get...

[Gudiomen]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

I mostly agree, but I would choose different effects for low WP. I'd treat 1/3 WP as an Irritating Condition, similar to Drowsy (-2 DX, IQ, and self-control). Zero WP would result in an Incapacitating Condition, akin to Daze (must Do Nothing, -4 to Active Defense). Negative WP might inflict mental disadvantages that linger even after the "damage" is healed, while -5xWP could cause permanent insanity or equivalently nasty effects.

That works too, but I'd roll at -WP and multiples for permanent mental pathology and garantee it outright at -5xWP.

I'd take care for this to be a SLOW mechanism, both in accumulating and recovering. People can work like lunatics for months before they start feeling the effects, and will take as much or more time to truly recover.

Most stressful situations will probably only do a WP of damage over long periods of time (stressful professions can do a WP of damage every year, another one if you skip or vacations, anotherone if you routinely do overtime... etc...).

If this mechanism is too fast it'll be unbelievable. The bets are off when involving the supernatural though, being exposed to things that Man Aught Not See. Should probably inflict several WP in a single go.

[Flyndaran]

Will points could add to or even supplant fright checks in my opinion.
Pushing against my real life disadvantages causes generic stress much more often than many of the odd results of the basic table.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by Gudiomen

I'd take care for this to be a SLOW mechanism, both in accumulating and recovering. People can work like lunatics for months before they start feeling the effects, and will take as much or more time to truly recover.

So if WP represent sanity/stress, how would they be recovered? Presumably you wouldn't be able to engage in work, adventure, or training - or if you do, you have a penalty to whatever check you need to recover. Likewise, total relaxation or vacation could give a bonus.

For more extreme WP loss, it may require professional intervention from psychiatrists. This would be used mostly to treat "crippling" effects, and would be TL dependent.

I don't know enough about recovering from stress to posit a time scale.