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Old 03-10-2015, 05:45 PM   #901
robkelk
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
...
Basically an alternate Game of Shodows plus the Canadians (who never get to be powerful villains) get the fun of being the evil empire. Please, remember villains aren't modest and self-effacing. Go over the top! Have fun Canada!
Oh, I wouldn't be so sure of the "modest and self-effacing" description ... Time to consult one of the more accessable introductions to Canadian (and world) history on the web: Hark, a vagrant

No, wait ...

So all we have to do for this alternate is play up the first batch of links and downplay the second batch...

(And this would have played out very differently: http://www.harkavagrant.com/index.php?id=364 )
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Old 03-10-2015, 09:46 PM   #902
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

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Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
This is actually a really solid reality seed. I like it. A few notes:

China is going to have some interesting changes: the historical capital in the north is completely flooded. The Qing have just taken over, and their home lands are on opposite side of the disaster area. This will either really boost chineese oceanic shipping activity, facilitate a rebellion against the Qing (who have much longer supply lines now)

You need Russia and France, not Russia and Germany. Or if you use Germany, use the Austrians instead of the Prussians (who lost almost everything). Not to mention Germany the nation didn't really exist until 1871. France should really prosper here. In the 1700's, France owned a large chunk of the Americas. With more aggressive European settlement, Louisianna may become its own prosperous holding. Oh, and France isn't loosing huge portions of land, so the power base is intact.
Unless the rising sea levels sparks the Franco-Prussian War early, then Germany would exist. Note that Alsace-Lorraine is likely still in German hands as WWI and WWII may well not have happened, or if they did, very differently.

Such aggressive European migration to may well trigger what the US calls the French and Indian War early as well, putting French claims in America in British hands.

Both of the above may well have happened at once, which explains why France lost both wars and why the British Empire didn't fall apart. Note that west of the Appalachian Mountains instead of RL US States there would be one or more Anglo-Indian Nations, don't know how far west this would extend before the British Empire would develop into another political arrangement.
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Old 03-11-2015, 04:53 AM   #903
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

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Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
This recently discovered Q-6 world seems to have divereged in the early 1700's. There was a gentle steady warming from that period onwards and a surprisingly rapid rise in world sea levels. The local year is now 1937 sea level stabilised, about fourty years ago, at 60 meters higher than on most Earths. There was a mass migration to the USA from much of Western Europe. The British Monarchy relocated to Halifax and then to Toronto.
Basically, it's the Canadian Empire in this timeline, whatever label it uses, and it probably dominates North America. Assuming that the sea level rise is somewhat linear, you've probably more or less lost London (and New York) before the American Revolution has a chance to develop (no Thames Flood Barrier, so a 15-20m rise makes the place a pond every really high tide), so unless the monarchy faffed about in the Pennines or Wales or the Scottish Highlands for a few decades before transferring, there will be a lot of reason to fight any such revolution to the finish. Though once the monarchy moves across the pond, the Americans will feel like a part of the core of the Empire, not neglected colonials; Washington becomes the timeline's equivalent of Wellington, not a revolutionary.

Though if Britain managed to snag India on schedule despite the transformations, there's be a certain temptation to go there instead. Except for the heat, and the horrors of mass starvation and desperate migration in the Indian coastal regions.

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Many areas of Europe are in fact more inhabitable than before the sea level rise, but the migration seems to have been as much about apocolyptic fears as anything else.
You make that sound irrational. You've just wiped out south-east England, Holland, and a lot of major ports. Heck, you've turned most of England into a malarial swamp, and flooded the lower Rhine Valley. (Cologne becomes a seaport, then floods.) The adjustment process is going to be apocalyptic, and the population base is going to be much lower at the end.

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Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
Russia and Germany vie for dominance of Europe ...
Bremen, Hamburg, and Berlin are gone. Hanover is a seaport. The rise of Prussia is aborted. Unless Saxony becomes a maritime-based superpower, there's probably nobody to stop an expansionist Russia east of the Alps.

Oh, and it looks like the Pope will spend much of his time blessing the Tiber dyke-builders.

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...the Anglo-Canadian Imperium seeks to rule the seas and Asia. The Japanese Empire casts hungry eyes at Australia, which is far greener and more fertile in this world than in most Earths.
Shame about the thin soils; you flooded the one good bit. (On the plus side, the Great Interior Sea actually exists on this timeline.) Plus, the Japanese have to get past the pirate-lords of what's left of the Philippines and Indonesia on the way.
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Old 03-11-2015, 05:56 AM   #904
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

http://flood.firetree.net/ can give you a 60m sea level rise these days, overlaid on Google Maps. Have fun. :-)
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Old 03-11-2015, 10:57 AM   #905
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

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Originally Posted by Phil Masters View Post
Basically, it's the Canadian Empire in this timeline, whatever label it uses, and it probably dominates North America. Assuming that the sea level rise is somewhat linear, you've probably more or less lost London (and New York) before the American Revolution has a chance to develop (no Thames Flood Barrier, so a 15-20m rise makes the place a pond every really high tide), so unless the monarchy faffed about in the Pennines or Wales or the Scottish Highlands for a few decades before transferring, there will be a lot of reason to fight any such revolution to the finish. Though once the monarchy moves across the pond, the Americans will feel like a part of the core of the Empire, not neglected colonials; Washington becomes the timeline's equivalent of Wellington, not a revolutionary.
The sea-level rise wasn't linear. It mainly happened between 1800 and 1897, but there were slight increases noticed by the 1780's. Canada and Austrilia are more fertile in this world (which doesn't seem all that much like the predicted gobal weather patterns for a warmer Homeline).

The Monarchy first moved to Winchester and then to Halifax.

Quote:
Though if Britain managed to snag India on schedule despite the transformations, there's be a certain temptation to go there instead. Except for the heat, and the horrors of mass starvation and desperate migration in the Indian coastal regions.
Britain has India in this world, and there are those suggesting the Monarch could/should move there. Note: Indians, Native Americans, and other Non-Whites, are more effectively integrated into both Anglo-Canadian and US society in this world than in Homeline at the same period. How this happened is unknown. But Victoria II is married to a Maharaja! The next king will be Arthur Rama the first.

Quote:
You make that sound irrational. You've just wiped out south-east England, Holland, and a lot of major ports. Heck, you've turned most of England into a malarial swamp, and flooded the lower Rhine Valley. (Cologne becomes a seaport, then floods.) The adjustment process is going to be apocalyptic, and the population base is going to be much lower at the end.
It's irrational only to the extent that Europe isn't going to be wiped off the map.

Quote:
Bremen, Hamburg, and Berlin are gone. Hanover is a seaport. The rise of Prussia is aborted. Unless Saxony becomes a maritime-based superpower, there's probably nobody to stop an expansionist Russia east of the Alps.

Oh, and it looks like the Pope will spend much of his time blessing the Tiber dyke-builders.
Good insights. But a renewed and transformed Holy Roman Empire might do the same as a Kaiserreich.

Quote:
Shame about the thin soils; you flooded the one good bit. (On the plus side, the Great Interior Sea actually exists on this timeline.) Plus, the Japanese have to get past the pirate-lords of what's left of the Philippines and Indonesia on the way.
Oh well a few good volcanic erruptions should provide fertiliser. ;-)
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Old 03-11-2015, 01:49 PM   #906
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

The loss of Florida makes the South a different place in the US Civil War. I can't imagine how it would change that war, but I suppose the South might have lost less industry than the North, balancing the war. Additionally, a warmer north could have focused more on agriculture and would have developed less industry in the first place.

Regardless, the discovery of gold in California would have changed. The Californian Sea would be hazardous (it's probably still clogged with snags and debris, let alone submerged structures), and the state's capital would be San Fransisco (probably regardless of who owns it). It was the last time Sacramento flooded...
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Old 03-11-2015, 02:50 PM   #907
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

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Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
The sea-level rise wasn't linear.
Was it geographically linear? That is, it rose globally a common amount in all places?
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Old 03-11-2015, 03:13 PM   #908
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
The sea-level rise wasn't linear. It mainly happened between 1800 and 1897, but there were slight increases noticed by the 1780's. Canada and Austrilia are more fertile in this world (which doesn't seem all that much like the predicted gobal weather patterns for a warmer Homeline).
Wow. That changes a lot of things -- and it does help your description. It should be noted in the original description. May I ask for water lines at different years? or ask at which point each of the 10 meter lines were reached?


Quote:
Good insights. But a renewed and transformed Holy Roman Empire might do the same as a Kaiserreich.
Europe's real winner here is Austria, which is pretty much going to take what's left of Germany. It might now have the balance and strength to not go to pieces at the end of a world war. And yeah, its going to have terrible relations with Russia. So when you say Germany, remember its further south and owns half the Balkans.

There really is room for a pair of world's here --one with the accelerated flooding in the 1800's, and one with the more gradual, constant flood. Hey, time this at any point and you have a decent alternate.
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Old 03-11-2015, 04:16 PM   #909
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

Within the space of a century, you've wiped out Holland, most of Europe's ports, much of north Germany, and much of Britain's best farmland. The social disruption will be monstrous, and there'll be megadeaths from waves of starvation and plague. Anyone who expects anything like our history following that period of horror is insanely optimistic.
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Old 03-11-2015, 04:32 PM   #910
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Default Re: New Reality Seeds

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Originally Posted by Phil Masters View Post
Within the space of a century, you've wiped out Holland, most of Europe's ports, much of north Germany, and much of Britain's best farmland. The social disruption will be monstrous, and there'll be megadeaths from waves of starvation and plague. Anyone who expects anything like our history following that period of horror is insanely optimistic.
Or is, you know, writing something set in alternate history and forcing matters, possibly for comedy
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