Bold Plan of Freedom

[Drakyrias]

Originally Posted by ladyarcana55

Ooh...change...

Makes me wonder if Janus would be a co-conspirator?

You Mean Valefor... you mean Janus.. which one is which, lol. A friend once told me theres conspiracy theory about Janus really being Valefor.

This plot being one of the biggest capers, stealing souls from hell itself, seems something Theft would like a piece of.

[ladyarcana55]

Originally Posted by SinsofDivinity

This plot being one of the biggest capers, stealing souls from hell itself, seems something Theft would like a piece of.

What if they were both involved? That would only fuel rumours and make for some interesting comedy, in Kobal's eyes

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by ladyarcana55

What if they were both involved? That would only fuel rumours and make for some interesting comedy, in Kobal's eyes

Theft and Dark Humor as allies? I can see that going south so easily. Remember, while a mass theft of souls would gratify Valefor hugely, a subsequent robbery of their hopes and dignity would put the cherry on top. (This is the DP credited with "stealing" the Russian Revolution, after all.) And while Kobal would love to pull such a great joke on the stuffed shirts of Hell, it gets even funnier if you can then set up the Ethereals to hit a banana peel on their way out the Gates ... and funniest of all if you can set it up so that Lilith somehow gets blamed by both sides.

Oooh, yeah. This could be a lot of fun.

[Rocket Man]

Originally Posted by SinsofDivinity

You Mean Valefor... you mean Janus.. which one is which, lol. A friend once told me theres conspiracy theory about Janus really being Valefor.

Yeah, there's a lot of conspiracy theories involving the two and why they're so similar despite hating each other intensely. Among them:

1) Valefor is really Janus in disguise.

2) Janus is really Valefor in disguise.

3) Both Janus and Valefor are disguises for an Ethereal who's infiltrated Heaven and Hell ... Loki and Hermes are the usual suspects.

4) My own personal theory, "fnorded" here in case my players come looking. (Highlight the blank space with your mouse to see it.) Janus and Valefor are two different beings in the same body, each unaware of the other. Every few days, Janus spontaneously Falls and becomes Valefor; every few days Valefor redeems and spontaneously becomes Janus -- and yes, that makes him the only being in the Symphony capable of a *spontaneous* redemption. As the embodiment of change, Janus represents the continuity between Destiny and Fate and will naturally bounce back and forth between the two until one possibility has triumphed and the other has faded to black.

[Acolyte]

I actually think Heaven would support this action. Obviously Laurence and Dominic would be uncomfortable with the idea, but even Laurence isn't paladin-ish enough to turn down the amazing tactical advantage that this terrible blow to Hell would be. Remember that Heaven knows it can beat down the Ethereals, having done so at the height of the gods' strength, so seeing them grow in power again isn't a long term threat. Having Hell lose a significant percentage of souls and a long-term Demon Prince whose nature is a vexing question is a HUGE victory for Heaven, and is an excellent way to recoup the initiative and momentum of the War. Michael, David, and Jordi are all very anti-Hell and it's implied that none of them have qualms working with Ethereals behind Laurence's back, so even in the absence of a Seraphim Council ruling directing Heaven to assist Lilith's defection to the Marches those are very powerful allies for her efforts.

If I were laying this out plotwise I think I would have Eli suddenly appear in front of the Seraphim Council when all the Archangels (or most of them, obviously Gabriel wouldn't be there, etc) were in session to reveal Lilith's plan and announce that it is the best interests of Creation for Heaven to support her. He'll pause to let the Seraphim validate the truth of his statement but won't take questions, naturally leaving to continue his mysterious absence. The resulting political furor splits Heaven into three major groups (I'll avoid factions, haha): Dominic and Laurence head a hardline group unwilling to work with Ethereals, David and Michael head an aggressive faction committed to seeing Lilith succeed, and Novalis and Yves head a third group with the audacious plan of somehow Redeeming as many of the escaping damned souls as possible. Since the latter two groups make a heavy majority in the Council, Heaven as a whole will help Lilith.

Depending on how her rebellion goes, this will fundamentally alter the balance of things in Heaven. If she is successful, there will be a three-part War but Heaven will be hugely powerful compared to looted Hell and nascent Paganlandia (or whatever the assembled pantheons and Lilith call their Empire), and this epic success will slash the political power of the archconservative AAs like Dominic and Laurence. Heaven on balance will become a more tolerant place, willing to work with the Ethereals against demons (and maybe demons against Ethereals, in time). At the same time, though, Heaven will become more interventionist, with Michael regularly attempting to provoke Armageddon without a strong Laurence to rein him in (he'll probably see Lilith's success as a divine mandate that Hell's time has come). If Lilith fails horribly, though, Dominic and Laurence will gain even more power, making Heaven both more intolerant and more hands-off on the corporeal plane--working with Ethereals might become a capital offense for angels of all Words, even Flowers, and more emphasis will be placed on letting the humans find their Destinies on their own, not with continuous hand-holding from angels.

---

In Hell, I don't see Lilith getting help from Kobal. While he would provide it, she's too smart to trust him even in the slightest, knowing that banana peel would be waiting somewhere in her future. She's most likely to get help from pro-human Princes like Andrealphus and Nybbas--Demon Princes whose Words will drastically fall in importance if Hell wins and there are no free humans left. If they can be convinced that they'll survive switching sides, they might--Nybbas can certainly operate outside of Hell with aplomb, though Andre might be a harder sell, having lived in Hell since, well, forever. Remember that Furfur owes everything he is to Lilith, and thus he might be an unwilling co-conspirator (he's not likely to do well in the Marches, so Lilith might use him and his Servitors as expendable muscle during the grand theft operation, making sure to expend them, or she'll force them to join her and use the fact that Hell will try to kill them to insure their loyalty to the new regime). Lastly, while trusting Malphas is a mistake no Superior is going to make, adding a third Faction (with a capital F) does swell his power, and if the pantheons end up uniting for protection behind Lilith there will be plenty of friction there, massively increasing the number of Servitors wandering around with conflicting agendas.

Of course, perhaps Lucifer, tired of the tyrannical establishment-rule rut that is Hell, has instigated the whole thing. Rebelling against his own rebellion is just the sort of thing for the Prince of Lies. Lilith might be his pawn.