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Old 02-07-2018, 09:34 AM   #1
Icelander
 
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
Default [Cutting-Edge Armor Design] Real World SCA-legal Armour and Ballistics Armour

I'm a fan of the 'Cutting-Edge Armor Design' in Pyramid #3/85. I'm still trying to get a grip on using it, however.

Has anyone used the system to stat out armour they can find information about in the real world?

If anyone has any write-ups of actual real-world armour, I'd really love it if you could post it in the thread, along with as much explanation for why you chose certain GURPS game-mechanical representations over others as you can be bothered with.

To take an example, what would a full 'Cutting-Edge Armor Design' look like for something like the SCA-legal Armstreet 'The Kingmaker'?

What about Re-Enactment Supplies 'Full Gothic Harness Without Legs'?

From Swords of Might, 'Ancient Armoury Wearable Knights Full Suit of Armor'?

Icefalcon Armoury 'Late 14th Century/ Early 15th Stainless with 301 Spring Stainless Harness'?

Can we get the GURPS stats to match observed performance, Cost* and Weight?

Going a little more modern, how would we stat a full suit (well, back, breast and sides of torso) of AR500 Armor Lightweight Level III+ Body Armor, as well as whatever plate carrier is necessary for it?

What about when worn with soft body armour, like AR500 Armor Hybrid IIIA?

Forumites who don't feel like doing my campaign prep work for me or who are not prepared to use the 'Cutting-Edge Armor Design' system for other reasons, are still invited to comment. I'd welcome thoughts on the real-world performance of SCA armour, for example, wisdom from those with experience of having such armour made or just general commentary vaguely related to the subject of detailed armour in the modern world.

TL8 SCA/Ren Faire Ballistic 'Black Knight' Harness

Finally, would anyone like to take a stab at making a suit of armour which looks sort of like a 'Black Knight' esque SCA or Renaissance Faire armour, but which incorporates soft ballistic weave armour instead of linen or canvas padding, where possible, and makes use of ballistic steel plates (at least for the upper torso, but elsewhere if practical)?

Bonus points if anyone can find links to manufacturers that might actually build the armour and/or deliver ballistic steel plates that can easily be incorporated into an SCA-legal suit by replacing the cuirass.

Weight should be in line with historical field harnesses, let's say something like 30-50 lbs. Designs weighing up to 80 lbs. may be considered if they are genuinely protective, over much of the important parts of the body, against standard mil-spec, surplus or common commercial 5.56x45mm and 7.62x39mm ammunition.

Let's shoot for a $3,000 or less design, making use of as much stuff as we can buy from Chinese companies**. Rifle protection on the upper chest and back and as widely as practical. At least decent knife protection over most of the body, pistol proof for the torso would be nice. The base design can use brigandine construction if that is much more convenient and/or cheaper.

It would be good to have a bulletproof helmet, if possible, but I doubt anyone is making thick sheets of ballistically proofed steel that has been manufactured in the shape of medieval-esque helmets.... I'm willing to be proved wrong, though. People often surprise you, wanting all sorts of crazy products.

A $5,000+ 'Black Knight' design and a $10,000+ 'Lord of Darkness' designs would not be out of line, either, if somebody finds that he's inspired to equip TL8 knights for his own campaign.*** The 'Lord of Darkness' suit may weigh anywhere up to 100 lbs., with up to 125 lbs. being suboptimal, but not impossible, if it adds significant capabilities.

I'll work up my own versions eventually, if no one proves willing to do the work for me, but I'd really appreciate some discussion that helped me benchmark the stats in 'Cutting-Edge Armor Design' against real products, real materials and real cost for both commercially available and custom-made protective wear in the years 2010-2018.

For inspirations for the looks, I'd say that Conquistador breastplates and morion helmets might be most appropriate, but the buyers won't be historians and will want actual movie-looking 'Knightly' gear, if possible. So, maybe Spanish reconquista armour for the authentic look (though I somehow doubt mail will fit their mental image well enough), 14th and 15th century Spanish brigandine, full-plate harnesses from Toledo or the ever-popular Gothic plate for the more expensive harness or possibly just a fantastical look.

Basically, what would crazy cultists/cartel gunmen from Mexico and Central America, who represent an extra-crazy splinter faction of the 'Caballero templarios' (Knight Templar Cartel), with an inner circle of 'Knights', think was cool armour?

Again, forumites who don't feel like actually submitting full stats are still encouraged to share their thoughts, concerns, questions or other comments.

Anyone with speculation on how plausible it is to have ballistic steel incorporated somehow into commercially available or custom-made re-enactor armour would be especially welcome. If my proposed prices are way off, that would be good to know, for example. And any suggestions as to how the cartel psychos could most plausibly have suits of armour for special occasions are appreciated. If there is no way they could get this in any plausible way and might, at most, be wearing modern ballistic vests with steel chest plates as well with plastic replicas of pauldrons and morion helmets instead, well, that would be valid input.

Edit: I'm currently considering flash bainite steel as the leading contender for the armour. This post summarises the facts I was able to find about its performance in GURPS terms. The website of Flash® Bainite, the company which invinted and marketed their particular process.

I realise that BHN 500-600 steel alloys, no matter how they are produced, will be almost impossible to shape into the contours necessary to armour the human body with a cool-looking plate harness. And welding FBA (Flash Bainite Armor) leaves weak areas at the joint. But you don't have to go for hardness that extreme to get better ballistic protection than TL4 proof breastplates, which demonstratably got DR 10+. So, does anyone have thoughts on the practicalities of using flash bainite to make black knight plate harness, in a private workshop, with an R&D, salary, materials and dedicated tools budget of ca $2,500,000?

With access to all the facilities of a custom car detailing facility with full machining and fabrication capability of a US Army Mobile Parts Hospital and, machinery from Flash® Bainite to perform their process. Note, this equipment is there for other reasons and doesn't come out of the budget.

*I'm fine with Cost being off by a slight amount, especially if Decorated, Luxury Pricing or Stylish Cost Factors (CFs) being included in the final price sounds plausible.
**With whom our hypothetical armour-desiring antagonists had cosy relationships, buying military and security products with forged end-user products, so buying ballistic armour plates from China should not run into legal issues. Of course, it would help to find manufacturers for the rest of the harness in China too, not only because it keeps costs down, but because it allows the buyers to use their shady contacts to avoid inconvenient trouble with regulations that ban the sale of ballistic armour to felons in some jurisdictions.
***I don't know, you could be playing 'GURPS Gotham' or something.
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Last edited by Icelander; 02-12-2018 at 12:58 PM.
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cutting-edge armor design, hema, jade serenity, pyramid #3/85, sca

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