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Old 07-27-2014, 10:09 PM   #41
namada
 
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Last edited by namada; 09-21-2014 at 12:07 AM.
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Old 07-27-2014, 10:17 PM   #42
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Originally Posted by fartrader View Post
No problem Otaku.

So anyway, I'm in full support of breaking Absolute Direction up into its component parts (primarily because I don't like #2 and #3 for my realistic games), which seem to be:
1. Dead Reckoning (Realistic version of "Can find your way back to previous locations easily.")
2. Mapping (Meta-Note to GM: Yeah, this is the Cinematic version of the above because I'm also not mapping your dungeon.)
3. Internal Compass (+1 Navigation, +3 Body Sense)
4. Seemingly, random, additional, +2 Navigation (though maybe make it +1 Navigation on Dead Reckoning and make that a leveled advantage? Or spread the rest of the +3 around, so that #1-3 each give +1 Navigation? Or both?)
5. 3D Spatial Sense (as-is)

Does that look like a good starting point? Am I missing anything in the list? There's clearly quite a bit going on in here for a very low cost, when you spread it out like that.
Ultra-Tech specifically provides that a "dead reckoning" inertial tracker gives +3 to Navigation, which is where your bonus comes from. An internal compass is no more than basic equipment for the skill.
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Old 07-27-2014, 10:28 PM   #43
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Old 07-29-2014, 05:06 PM   #44
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Old 07-29-2014, 05:36 PM   #45
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Originally Posted by fartrader View Post
2. Mapping (Meta-Note to GM: Yeah, this is the Cinematic version of the above because I'm also not mapping your dungeon.)
Why do you think that Absolute Direction does this?
Player Made Maps (B491) only says that it gives +3 to cartography for overland maps and Mapping (Dungeon Fantasy 2: Dungeons p. 6) doesn't mention Absolute Direction at all.

Always knowing North and being able to retrace your steps isn't the same as being able to remember that the Room of the Six Gold Frog Statues was on level three behind the Talking Arch, and it shouldn't let you see that there's probably a secret room in that space between the Chapel of the Weeping Altar and the hall that leads to the Font of Doom.
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Old 07-29-2014, 06:01 PM   #46
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Well, no one else has taken a stab at pricing those, so here I go:

#1, according to "new advantages" every +1 to a single skill is 2 points of cost. Since +3 on a Navigation roll to find previous locations covers "dead reckoning," that means this costs 6 points. But that's only useful to Navigation for finding previously visited locations, so that's an accessibility limitation, which lowers the final cost to 4 points for Dead Reckoning.

#2, 5 points seems a fair price to pay for the privilege granted by Intuitive Mapper, though I'm honestly not sure, and 10 points may be more appropriate for this meta-gaming ability, I keep flipping back-and-forth on that one.

#3, This was noted as being a Perk up-thread, so 1 point, for Internal Compass.

So, Absolute Direction, as written, should be 10 points (or 15, depending on Intuitive Mapper), and 3D Spatial Sense, works as written and adds +5 points. Thoughts?
When something doesn't prove as valuable as the crunchier part of RAW indicates, doesn't the rest of RAW allow those crunchier bits to be overridden? Plus some Advantages are intentionally under priced due to the benefit they have for the game in being so; Combat Reflexes is pretty much notorious for this, yes?

Please note the lack of citations; I am asking because of some hazy memories.

I realize also that there will be specific characters/settings that can make any one trait awesome or awful... which is again why CP cost can be varied by the GM; when value goes up it can be easier just to levy an Unusual Background cost (even if lacking the trait might be more "unusual") but this can mess up Enhancements and Limitations, plus we don't have negative U.B.s, do we?
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Old 07-29-2014, 06:15 PM   #47
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Old 07-29-2014, 07:05 PM   #48
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

That could be perk: no nuisance rolls assuming the advantage gives a high enough bonus to internal mapping.
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Old 07-29-2014, 07:07 PM   #49
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

I really don't like the internal compass aspect. That is merely one way of many to navigate.
Many animals once thought to have them for accurate navigation have now proved to have different, and in my opinion, more interesting methods.
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Old 07-29-2014, 07:51 PM   #50
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Default Re: [Basic] Advantage of the Week: 3D Spatial Sense/Absolute Direction

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Absolute Direction, as written, offers zero possibility of failure for retracing your steps because there is no need for a skill roll (thus no need to map the dungeon layout, not that you'd remember every detail of every room), whereas my more "realistic" version of "Dead Reckoning" has the possibility of failure because it requires a Navigation roll to achieve.

So, I've separated the cinematic Intuitive Mapper (couldn't think up a better name), and realistic Dead Reckoning, here and didn't want to confuse things by giving them the same name is all (even though it's really just a Realistic/Cinematic break in the same ability - dead reckoning).
Being able to accurately retrace your steps isn't remotely the same as having a map. Retracing your steps means going back exactly as you came no matter how inefficient the route was. It also fails if the back track isn't traversable. It doesn't tell you where anything is. It doesn't show you alternate routes. It doesn't record unexplored passages. It doesn't show the layout and allow you to deduce hidden areas.
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