Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-16-2019, 03:29 PM   #31
AlexanderHowl
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Quote:
Originally Posted by adm View Post
Good point on the subsidies, the weight however would still be a factor on cost to orbit.
Not when the solar panels are produced on the Moon and assembled at the L4/L5 colonies. The only lift costs after the setup of the lunar mines are for the people who you send to the Moon and the L4/L5 colonies and any supplies that they cannot produce up there. With the cost of $300 per kg from the reusable SM+10 TL7 rockets described in the previous posts, you are probably talking about a launch cost of $400 billion per year by 2020 to support a $4 trillion per year space industry.
AlexanderHowl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 04:50 PM   #32
adm
 
adm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: MO, U.S.A.
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Fair enough.
__________________
Xenophilia is Dr. Who. Plus Lecherous is Jack Harkness.- Anaraxes
adm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 04:54 PM   #33
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantasm View Post
This timeline is treading a fine line where the forum's RealPolitics rules are concerned, I think. Let's not focus too hard on the politics.
I'm going to say that there is enough politics in this timeline for me to find it politically tendentious, and perhaps even partisan. It would put me off as a campaign setting or a published supplement. I certainly have strong opinions, but I try to keep them out of my settings.
__________________
Bill Stoddard

A human being should know how to live fast, die young, and leave a beautiful corpse. Specialization is for insects.
whswhs is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 04:59 PM   #34
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Quote:
Originally Posted by adm View Post
As somebody that lived across the border in the Ozarks, I suspect that H. Clinton would have had a decent shot at becoming a Senator from Arkansas, in a history where a Democratic Party South did not collapse. Given the generally more successful Democratic party posited here, it is not an unreasonable inclusion.
It seems to me the Democratic South had already collapsed by 1972, with Nixon's southern strategy. What followed under Reagan was mopping up.
__________________
Bill Stoddard

A human being should know how to live fast, die young, and leave a beautiful corpse. Specialization is for insects.

Last edited by whswhs; 06-16-2019 at 05:02 PM.
whswhs is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 05:04 PM   #35
Mysterious Dark Lord v3.2
 
Mysterious Dark Lord v3.2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: My in-laws' house (damn economy ...)
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Quote:
Originally Posted by adm View Post
Why does he need to die, or not exist? Give him a change of career, or an early election loss.
Because those of us who are old enough to remember his kvetching and sabotage of the space program want the spiritual satisfaction of having him crushed by a giant cheese wheel.
__________________
"When you talk about damage radius, even atomic weapons pale before that of an unfettered idiot in a position of power."
- Sam Starfall from the webcomic Freefall
Mysterious Dark Lord v3.2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 05:45 PM   #36
Astromancer
On Notice
 
Astromancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: West Virginia
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mysterious Dark Lord v3.2 View Post
Because those of us who are old enough to remember his kvetching and sabotage of the space program want the spiritual satisfaction of having him crushed by a giant cheese wheel.
We share the same pain!
__________________
Per Ardua Per Astra!


Ancora Imparo
Astromancer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 05:49 PM   #37
AlexanderHowl
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Quote:
Originally Posted by whswhs View Post
It seems to me the Democratic South had already collapsed by 1972, with Nixon's southern strategy. What followed under Reagan was mopping up.
Democrats controlled the NC legislature until 2010, and there were plenty of other Democratic Party strongholds in the South until 1994. I knew people in NC in the 90s who would not vote Republican because of Lincoln.
AlexanderHowl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 06:30 PM   #38
whswhs
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
Democrats controlled the NC legislature until 2010, and there were plenty of other Democratic Party strongholds in the South until 1994. I knew people in NC in the 90s who would not vote Republican because of Lincoln.
If you're going that way, though, there doesn't seem to be any obvious reason that HRC would be able to advance her career like that. She only got into elected office after WJC was in the White House, and it was the same kind of deal where New York elects an out of state candidate to the Senate who has tied to a former president, as when they elected Robert Kennedy in 1964; in both cases the new Senator had no prior history of elected office. (There were jokes in 1964 about Massachusetts being the only state with three senators.) I'm not persuaded that New York would have even considered her as a candidate without WJC's presidency, or that Arkansas would have considered her at all—they certainly didn't when WJC was governor, or president, or former president.

Even if you suppose she got into the Senate, somehow, I don't see anything to distinguish her from the other forty or fifty Democratic senators, if "married to the former president" wasn't on her CV.

I think you're conserving too much of our world's political history in what is meant to be an AH. It's like novels where US history diverged during the Civil War, but somehow Richard Nixon was still born and had a career in politics.
__________________
Bill Stoddard

A human being should know how to live fast, die young, and leave a beautiful corpse. Specialization is for insects.
whswhs is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 09:06 PM   #39
AlexanderHowl
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

Unlike in our timeline, HRC would have won in 2008, rather than have failed in 2016. It is hardly important though, the divergence is set in 1969, and all of the people who became president in the ATL have already been born, so they have a chance. If we assume that their genetics and their environment play a role in the success, not just blind chance, then they would have the essential inertia by 1977, when Teddy became President (and when the divergence starts to matter for the entire nation).

A more successful Democratic Party would have been in the cards had Teddy not had the scandal and had won 1976. With him being followed by Glenn in 1984, and with Glenn succeeding in overseeing the end of the Cold War and the beginning of energy production from the orbital solar array, the momentum would have only continued. Brown would have been a nature choice due to the progressive momentum from 16 years of Democratic administrations, but I think that he would have dampened some of the appeal with more radical social programs.

McCain would have been a natural choice from there on (without the first Bush presidency, I doubt a second one would have been in the works). Beyond that, moderate Democrats and/or moderate Republicans are a natural fit, as the Southern Strategy of Nixon would have been a mixed success, stengthening the moderate Republican wing. HRC was a Goldwater girl in her youth, so she may have stayed moderate Republican in such a divergence, even if her husband was a Democratic governor, and may have been able to become a Republican President. Obama could be have also been a moderate Republican in such a divergence.
AlexanderHowl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-16-2019, 10:04 PM   #40
adm
 
adm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: MO, U.S.A.
Default Re: Sol-1 [Infinite Worlds]

While I can see HRC still becoming a Senator in Arkansas, I don't see her translating that to the Presidency. There are other politicians that may do better at this point, such as Gary Hart, Al Gore, or third tier guys like Dick Gephardt, that may do better than in your changed back ground.
__________________
Xenophilia is Dr. Who. Plus Lecherous is Jack Harkness.- Anaraxes
adm is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:21 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.