[DF] Magic Items: A little goes a long way?

Pragmatic · 06-03-2017, 09:23 AM

I was looking into the Metatronic Generator, in terms of how to convert magic items from D&D (various editions) to DF, because I like D&D as a source of inspiration. (More into "inspiration" than "direct conversions"...)

I saw the sample magic items that Ghostdancer posted (Link to SJ Games thread), one of which was the Staff of the Magi. And it was priced at $2.8M.

Which made me wonder, how many magic items are there in the typical DF game, and how powerful are they? How toned-down do you have to "translate" D&D items so they fit into the power levels of DF?

Bruno · 06-03-2017, 10:56 AM

I haven't found a need to "tone down" D&D magic items at all, and I'm a little puzzled why you feel a need to?

The Staff of the Magi is a lesser artifact, of course it's valued in the millions of G$ - but remember a G$ is a cp, not a gp. That's 35,000gp - with the AD&D 2e DMG valuing it at 15,000xp (which is very loosely 15,000gp at the 1gp=1xp system) that seems about the right order of magnitude - I wouldn't sweat being about twice the value, it'll be hard to liquidize anyways.

In general, yes, magic items in GURPS are worth lots of GURPS $. I haven't found that a problem - they're often hard to sell at full value, PCs generally don't sell them immediately, and after all it's only imaginary money.

I certainly don't mind having a magic weapon or piece of armor or whatever knocking around in the loot from the PCs first adventure, and really from there things have the potential to escalate. I don't require handing out something shiny and magic in the first adventure - to be honest I tend to roll a lot of random treasure from DF8. It's fun.

An important thing is to make sure the PCs have a chance to stay ahead of their costs for consumables (potions etc), cost of housing, training costs, and a nice profit on top of that to upgrade something ever now and then along with just living nicely for a while. If they didn't make enough money doing what they're doing, they'd be crazy to keep doing it.

Christopher R. Rice · 06-03-2017, 04:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

I was looking into the Metatronic Generator, in terms of how to convert magic items from D&D (various editions) to DF, because I like D&D as a source of inspiration. (More into "inspiration" than "direct conversions"...)

I saw the sample magic items that Ghostdancer posted (Link to SJ Games thread), one of which was the Staff of the Magi. And it was priced at $2.8M.

Do note, that's in TL8 money. A TL3 would be around 140k.

Bruno · 06-04-2017, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ghostdancer

Do note, that's in TL8 money. A TL3 would be around 140k.

Well jeeze that's 1,750gp. That's actually quite a bit lower than what I expected.

Christopher R. Rice · 06-04-2017, 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruno

Well jeeze that's 1,750gp. That's actually quite a bit lower than what I expected.

I'd probably make it all cost 5x as much for "weird magic" or just make it a relic. But but that's just me.

Pragmatic · 06-06-2017, 12:37 PM

Apologies, I intend to reply with more questions, but am in midst of crunch time at work

Pragmatic · 06-08-2017, 09:32 PM

Okay, came up with a question. It's about ioun stones.

How do you treat the stones floating around your head? I'm guessing it's a feature and you don't stat it up?

Christopher R. Rice · 06-08-2017, 09:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pragmatic

Okay, came up with a question. It's about ioun stones.

How do you treat the stones floating around your head? I'm guessing it's a feature and you don't stat it up?

Yup. It's basically No Legs (Aerial).

hal · 06-09-2017, 12:14 AM

For what it is worth, I ran into an issue trying to convert coin costs for something in one game system, and then trying to either convert to GURPS or from GURPS to the other system.

My general rule of thumb is to find what the monthly income value is for the game system (if such even exists), and then price things in terms of monthly income.

For instance, if something is listed as being 15,000 coins (doesn't matter what for this instance), and normal income per month is about 1,000 coins - then the item should cost about 15 month's income. If in GURPS, monthly income is about $700, then 15 x 700 = $10,500 GURPS.

I ran into that issue when trying to convert GURPS values into Silver pennies of medieval times. If using a strict $4 GURPS = 1 silver penny, something that was valued at $32,000 GURPS would be worth either of...

A) 8,000 silver pennies

or

B) using my method of monthly income 32,000/700 = 45.71 month's income, which, at say, 30 silver pennies income per month, translates into about 1371 silver pennies.

BIG difference between 8,000 silver pennies and 1371 silver pennies.

I'm not familiar enough with wages or currencies from D&D ( last D&D book I ever purchased was 3.5, and used it maybe three times overall). But that's how I'd approach the problem (in terms of monthly income values rather than strict currency conversion rates).

sir_pudding · 06-09-2017, 01:26 AM

The last few editions of D&D have prices such that PCs get drained of loot, but can easily hire cheap labor, the end result is that prices are inflated relative to wages. In Pathfinder an unskilled laborer makes 1sp/day, which means he can afford one poor quality meal per day and nothing else. He needs to save up 20 days pay for a knife. The prices aren't based on anything except game balance for PC adventurers.

06-03-2017, 09:23 AM	#1
Pragmatic Ceci n'est pas une tag. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Vancouver, WA (Portland Metro)	[DF] Magic Items: A little goes a long way? I was looking into the Metatronic Generator, in terms of how to convert magic items from D&D (various editions) to DF, because I like D&D as a source of inspiration. (More into "inspiration" than "direct conversions"...) I saw the sample magic items that Ghostdancer posted (Link to SJ Games thread), one of which was the Staff of the Magi. And it was priced at $2.8M. Which made me wonder, how many magic items are there in the typical DF game, and how powerful are they? How toned-down do you have to "translate" D&D items so they fit into the power levels of DF? __________________ I'm a collector, not a gamer. =)

06-03-2017, 10:56 AM	#2
Bruno Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Canada	Re: [DF] Magic Items: A little goes a long way? I haven't found a need to "tone down" D&D magic items at all, and I'm a little puzzled why you feel a need to? The Staff of the Magi is a lesser artifact, of course it's valued in the millions of G$ - but remember a G$ is a cp, not a gp. That's 35,000gp - with the AD&D 2e DMG valuing it at 15,000xp (which is very loosely 15,000gp at the 1gp=1xp system) that seems about the right order of magnitude - I wouldn't sweat being about twice the value, it'll be hard to liquidize anyways. In general, yes, magic items in GURPS are worth lots of GURPS $. I haven't found that a problem - they're often hard to sell at full value, PCs generally don't sell them immediately, and after all it's only imaginary money. I certainly don't mind having a magic weapon or piece of armor or whatever knocking around in the loot from the PCs first adventure, and really from there things have the potential to escalate. I don't require handing out something shiny and magic in the first adventure - to be honest I tend to roll a lot of random treasure from DF8. It's fun. An important thing is to make sure the PCs have a chance to stay ahead of their costs for consumables (potions etc), cost of housing, training costs, and a nice profit on top of that to upgrade something ever now and then along with just living nicely for a while. If they didn't make enough money doing what they're doing, they'd be crazy to keep doing it. __________________ All about Size Modifier; Unified Hit Location Table A Wiki for my F2F Group A neglected GURPS blog

06-06-2017, 12:37 PM	#6
Pragmatic Ceci n'est pas une tag. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Vancouver, WA (Portland Metro)	Re: [DF] Magic Items: A little goes a long way? Apologies, I intend to reply with more questions, but am in midst of crunch time at work __________________ I'm a collector, not a gamer. =)

06-08-2017, 09:32 PM	#7
Pragmatic Ceci n'est pas une tag. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Vancouver, WA (Portland Metro)	Re: [DF] Magic Items: A little goes a long way? Okay, came up with a question. It's about ioun stones. How do you treat the stones floating around your head? I'm guessing it's a feature and you don't stat it up? __________________ I'm a collector, not a gamer. =)

06-09-2017, 12:14 AM	#9
hal Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Buffalo, New York	Re: [DF] Magic Items: A little goes a long way? For what it is worth, I ran into an issue trying to convert coin costs for something in one game system, and then trying to either convert to GURPS or from GURPS to the other system. My general rule of thumb is to find what the monthly income value is for the game system (if such even exists), and then price things in terms of monthly income. For instance, if something is listed as being 15,000 coins (doesn't matter what for this instance), and normal income per month is about 1,000 coins - then the item should cost about 15 month's income. If in GURPS, monthly income is about $700, then 15 x 700 = $10,500 GURPS. I ran into that issue when trying to convert GURPS values into Silver pennies of medieval times. If using a strict $4 GURPS = 1 silver penny, something that was valued at $32,000 GURPS would be worth either of... A) 8,000 silver pennies or B) using my method of monthly income 32,000/700 = 45.71 month's income, which, at say, 30 silver pennies income per month, translates into about 1371 silver pennies. BIG difference between 8,000 silver pennies and 1371 silver pennies. I'm not familiar enough with wages or currencies from D&D ( last D&D book I ever purchased was 3.5, and used it maybe three times overall). But that's how I'd approach the problem (in terms of monthly income values rather than strict currency conversion rates).

06-09-2017, 01:26 AM	#10
sir_pudding Wielder of Smart Pants Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Ventura CA	Re: [DF] Magic Items: A little goes a long way? The last few editions of D&D have prices such that PCs get drained of loot, but can easily hire cheap labor, the end result is that prices are inflated relative to wages. In Pathfinder an unskilled laborer makes 1sp/day, which means he can afford one poor quality meal per day and nothing else. He needs to save up 20 days pay for a knife. The prices aren't based on anything except game balance for PC adventurers.