[MH] [RPM] Does a target know that somone cast a spell on him?

[Tinman]

I was GM-ing our weekly MH campaign last night. The PC witch & 2 others were stopped by 7 D.C. Police in full riot gear (during riots in the city). The sergeant in charge started questioning them & asked for ID. The PC's had there faces & race changed by the witch's magic. The ID they had was there real ID & would not match. The witch then decides to use an area affect mind control (conditional) on the cops. He succeeds with affecting 5 of the 7, but not the sergeant. - We stopped there because there is a disagreement on what the sergeant knows.

My question is this: What does the sergeant know?
Does he know automaticly that his mind has been attacked?
Should he have a roll to see if he knows that his mind has been attacked?
If he has no knowlege of the occult, he knows nothing & gets no roll?

I know that I'm GM & my rule is law, ect... but I want tho know if there is a RAW answer and if not, then what others think should be the answer.

Thanks in advance for all the feedback.

[gilbertocarlos]

He doesn't know, except if he knows about magic, then, he should be able to roll IQ or Per to know.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Tinman

Does he know automatically that his mind has been attacked?

No, he does not.

Originally Posted by Tinman

Should he have a roll to see if he knows that his mind has been attacked?

Mind Control is an intrusive mental effect; the target may notice it. He would roll Perception, less his margin of failure, to notice if he had failed to resist and so been affected. He would roll Perception, unmodified, to notice if he successfully resisted but the witch didn't critically fail its' roll. He would automatically notice the attempt if the witch critically failed.

If he noticed it, he would then roll against the better of Expert (Magic), Occultism-2, Psychology or IQ-4 with an additional modifier as per the Perception check above -- at +5 if the witch critically failed -- in order to figure out what just happened.

He isn't likely to appreciate it and his reaction would be filtered through his culture and knowledge.

Per (GURPS Psionic Powers, pg 11 - pg 12) anywise.

[lexington]

He knows the weirdo mumbled some words and then his people started acting weird. Let him roll IQ-7 (if it was lesser) or IQ-5 (if it was greater), essentially allowing him a default roll on Thaumatology since he's just witnessed real magic right in front of him. A success wouldn't have to mean that he suddenly understands that magic exists, only that he understands the Witch did something.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by lexington

He knows the weirdo mumbled some words and then his people started acting weird. Let him roll Per-7 (if it was lesser) or Per-5 (if it was greater), he's just witnessed real magic right in front of him. A success wouldn't have to mean that he suddenly understands that magic exists, only that he understands the Witch did something.

Only if the Witch received an energy cost discount for Traditional Trappings and defined those Traditional Trapping as it using magic words. RPM casting doesn't involve anything mundanely noticeable.

[Raekai]

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Only if the Witch received an energy cost discount for Traditional Trappings and defined those Traditional Trapping as it using magic words. RPM casting doesn't involve anything mundanely noticeable.

Do you have ideas for how much those spell components should discount? Hand movements, words, etc. I always found it cool that with RPM, you don't need anything to cast.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Raekai

Do you have ideas for how much those spell components should discount? Hand movements, words, etc. I always found it cool that with RPM, you don't need anything to cast.

I've been giving:
-2% for foot motions
-4% for dancing in place
-5% for dancing all over the place
-2% for gestures with one hand
-4% for gestures with both hands
-5% for extravagant gestures with both hands
-2% for softly spoken incantations
-4% for conversation-volume spoken incantations
-5% for shouted incantations

So a witch who does a little dance, hipshot, with the head thing going on, snaps the fingers of their left hand aggressively and calls the target naughty names under their breath gets a total of an 8% energy cost reduction.

Adapted from the Flexible and Extravagant Rituals on (GURPS Thaumatology, pg 37).

[Tinman]

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Only if the Witch received an energy cost discount for Traditional Trappings and defined those Traditional Trapping as it using magic words. RPM casting doesn't involve anything mundanely noticeable.

Well the witch had it as a conditional spell. According to the MH book: The condition must be simple enough that a person watching the subject would automatically be aware of it happening. So the witch had to gesture/point at the target location (the head cop) & had to say "Trigger Mind Control #1" in ancient Egyption.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Tinman

Well the witch had it as a conditional spell. According to the MH book: The condition must be simple enough that a person watching the subject would automatically be aware of it happening. So the witch had to gesture/point at the target location (the head cop) & had to say "Trigger Mind Control #1" in ancient Egyption.

That works!

In which case its' an unmodified Perception roll to notice something happened and then the better of (stuff already posted) to determine that it wasn't just a weirdo cursing them out in a foreign language. :)

[Tinman]

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Mind Control is an intrusive mental effect; the target may notice it. He would roll Perception, less his margin of failure, to notice if he had failed to resist and so been affected. He would roll Perception, unmodified, to notice if he successfully resisted but the witch didn't critically fail its' roll. He would automatically notice the attempt if the witch critically failed.

If he noticed it, he would then roll against the better of Expert (Magic), Occultism-2, Psychology or IQ-4 with an additional modifier as per the Perception check above -- at +5 if the witch critically failed -- in order to figure out what just happened.

He isn't likely to appreciate it and his reaction would be filtered through his culture and knowledge.

Sunrunner is the above just an adaptation of the rules from the psionic powers book?