08-27-2016, 04:12 AM | #31 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Portsmouth, VA, USA
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
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Apologies, I could have sworn you mentioned at one point that you'd worked with Jane's.
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08-27-2016, 08:51 AM | #32 | |
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
Ghostdancer, authority really doesn't work that way. Rules text is what it is and we all can read it, whether or not it's what the author intended it to be. Not that that's relevant here.
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I'd thought your remark about usually only the first shot hitting meant you were saying subsequent shots shouldn't be effecting the roll to hit, and thus Rcl shouldn't, but clearly that was my mistake. ...What were you getting at?
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08-29-2016, 12:30 AM | #33 | |
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Brighton
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
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1). Rcl doesn't effect the chances of the first round hitting, which is correct 2). Rcl does effect the chances of subsequent rounds hitting, which is also correct But here's the thing, first has two meanings here. It can be the first round that leaves the gun, and the first round that hits from the burst i.e the one that was most likely to hit. And the abstract way GURPS does rapid fires means that can be different rounds, but in real life they tend to be the same round. And for the purposes of rapid fire rules both are correct at the same time However overall what gets bit more hazy is that you can fire lots of rounds to partially overcome that effects of Rcl*, because the more rounds you fire in GURPS the rapid fire positive mod can partially counteract the negative Rcl mod. However IMO this is an artefact of the way the Rcl is per round factor, but rapid fire is per burst factor (as pointed out condensing the entire burst into one roll is trade off for the sake of playability, and involves certain amounts do abstraction in overall effect). Conceptually the two factors do interact in an odd way if you look closely, but the rapid fire rules are about giving a overall realistic effect (with out rolling to it for every round, which you could just do by removing the to rapid fire bonus). *obviously Rcl builds at a faster rate than the Rapid fire bonus, but as again it does so round by round, where as rapid fire applies once to the entire burst. Last edited by Tomsdad; 08-29-2016 at 12:50 AM. |
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08-29-2016, 01:12 AM | #34 | |
Join Date: Sep 2014
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
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Burst and automatic fire are intended to increase overall chance to hit at least once. No one said otherwise. Realistically some weapons are better in full-auto (i.e. in increasing overall chance to hit while rapidly firing multiple rounds) than the others due to controllability. In GURPS increasing overall chance to hit is a function of RoF (Rapid Fire bonus), not a function of controllability. That is, shooting some sort of short-barreled automatic shotgun loaded with rifled slugs while stock folded (Rcl about 5) at RoF 9 augments your chance to hit just as well as shooting H&K MP5 at the same RoF. I think that limiting Rapid Fire bonus for high-Rcl weapons makes sense and looks realistic. Am I still wrong with that? Aforementioned stories about machinegunners and M14-users shooting short bursts rather than spraying and praying reinforce this concept: if your weapon's controllability is bad, there's no much benefit from shooting at full possible RoF.
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When in deadly danger, When beset by doubt, Run in little circles, Wave your arms and shout. Last edited by Erling; 08-29-2016 at 01:16 AM. |
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08-29-2016, 01:21 AM | #35 |
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southeast NC
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
One point that hasn't been raised is that, even if you don't get a bonus on the attack roll, multiple rounds fired gives a slight increase to the odds of causing a wound. There is a chance of getting two hits, which would require a better defense roll to totally counter.
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08-29-2016, 01:22 AM | #36 |
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
Short bursts do two things: conserve ammo and keep the barrel from overheating as quickly (which is enough of a problem that nearly every air-cooled MG in the world has a spare barrel as part of its standard kit). The first is related to controlibility, the second isn't.
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08-29-2016, 01:25 AM | #37 | |
Join Date: Sep 2014
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
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08-29-2016, 06:55 AM | #38 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Helmouth, The Netherlands
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
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08-29-2016, 07:54 AM | #39 |
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Oklahoma City
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
The answer for most slugthrowing anti-aircraft systems is "more dakka," so I'd say capping it isn't realistic—otherwise, adding more would be pointless.
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08-29-2016, 08:07 AM | #40 |
Join Date: Sep 2014
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Re: Rapid Fire bonus and Rcl
Do they have high Rcl? Even 25x137 autocannon has Rcl 2. I suggested bonus cap only for high-Rcl weapons (i.e, Rcl 3+).
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