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Old 12-20-2019, 01:26 AM   #621
Anders
 
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Default Re: Exotic Governmental/Legal Systems

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Originally Posted by Agemegos View Post
Then who was it?
I don't remember.
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Old 12-20-2019, 02:12 AM   #622
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All you have to to is ensure that only a minority possess the mental capacity for hyperspace navigation. Maybe it drives everyone else nuts.
Yes, for space campaigns. I was trying to frame it so that you can use it on one planet at lower TLs.
Maybe the oceans are so dangerous that the wooden, small, age-of-sail ships that are the best under the present tech can only be used for coastal shipping. Meanwhile the lucrative ocean-going trade is the preserve of those ancient, big, high-tech ships, and the family who own them are the nobles of this planet.
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Old 12-20-2019, 09:27 AM   #623
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All you have to to is ensure that only a minority possess the mental capacity for hyperspace navigation. Maybe it drives everyone else nuts.
Maybe it drives everyone nuts, and nobles are the ones who can still function despite the crazy. Could make for an interesting setting if the ruling families are all mad. Terrifying, yes, but interesting.
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Old 12-20-2019, 09:43 AM   #624
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Maybe it drives everyone nuts, and nobles are the ones who can still function despite the crazy. Could make for an interesting setting if the ruling families are all mad. Terrifying, yes, but interesting.
This is beginning to sound like the Spacer Guild from Dune. But without the whole Melange thang, and then mixed with something that sounds akin to the Tessier-Ashpools from Neuromancer.

Petulant hyperspace navigators, what could go wrong?

EDIT: If their livelihood is space based, why are they interested in planetary based resources or industries? Surely they'd be more interested in controlling the hubs of interstellar trade, along with any associated Zero-G related industrial complexes. Their relationship with the populations on the planets which they orbit could be akin to that of the various business interests which inhabited the Bund of pre WWII Shanghai, and the polities and societies which made up Thirties China. Vaguely predatory, possibly.
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Old 12-20-2019, 02:54 PM   #625
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This is beginning to sound like the Spacer Guild from Dune. But without the whole Melange thang, and then mixed with something that sounds akin to the Tessier-Ashpools from Neuromancer.

Petulant hyperspace navigators, what could go wrong?

EDIT: If their livelihood is space based, why are they interested in planetary based resources or industries? Surely they'd be more interested in controlling the hubs of interstellar trade, along with any associated Zero-G related industrial complexes. Their relationship with the populations on the planets which they orbit could be akin to that of the various business interests which inhabited the Bund of pre WWII Shanghai, and the polities and societies which made up Thirties China. Vaguely predatory, possibly.
The way I imagine it, planets are where the real money is, simply due to population and resource advantages. Without planets sending goods through space, interstellar trade is much poorer. (Also, I'm envisioning this aristocracy as controlling interstellar travel, not necessarily interplanetary travel.) So the Navigator Houses compete largely with each other and view solar systems as resource bases. They prefer fractured ones where they can pit various planetary powers against each other, and have to tread carefully against systems with strong unified governments.

A lot of it's going to boil down to some specifics of FTL and tech, not to mention setting assumptions. A setting where FTL engines are cheap and it's the navigator's unique and inimitable psychic talents that are needed is a lot different from one where ancient and rare FTL engines are keyed to certain bloodlines, and any old aristo can (literally) be plugged into the ship as long they're of the right lineage.
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Old 12-20-2019, 04:30 PM   #626
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... A setting where FTL engines are cheap ... is a lot different from one where ancient and rare FTL engines are keyed to certain bloodlines...
Interesting point.
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Old 12-20-2019, 05:07 PM   #627
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Default Re: Exotic Governmental/Legal Systems

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Originally Posted by Luke Bunyip View Post
This is beginning to sound like the Spacer Guild from Dune. But without the whole Melange thang, and then mixed with something that sounds akin to the Tessier-Ashpools from Neuromancer.

Petulant hyperspace navigators, what could go wrong?

EDIT: If their livelihood is space based, why are they interested in planetary based resources or industries? Surely they'd be more interested in controlling the hubs of interstellar trade, along with any associated Zero-G related industrial complexes. Their relationship with the populations on the planets which they orbit could be akin to that of the various business interests which inhabited the Bund of pre WWII Shanghai, and the polities and societies which made up Thirties China. Vaguely predatory, possibly.
Perhaps the effect on navigators is something similar to profound autism; those born with the Gift can fly through FTL space, but they wind up interested only in flying spaceships from planet to planet. The rest of their Houses are those in whom the Gift is milder - they can't fly ships through FTL, but they're pretty good at negotiating trade deals. And since the Gift is genetically related, after a couple of centuries most if not all of those with it will be born to one of the existing Navigator Houses. (And of course if someone is born with a mutation giving them the gene, the Houses might well be very interested in either recruiting this mutant or killing them before they can be used to break the monopoly. Story hook: there are, of course, those who want to help such a mutant, with the specific intent of opening up interstellar travel to those outside the Noble Houses...)
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Old 04-02-2020, 01:17 PM   #628
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Default Re: Exotic Governmental/Legal Systems

A vote for a cabinet member is not a traditional "one vote at a time." Instead every member has the vote he had there by default like a light switch which remains on until it is off. Thus everyone can remain in office for a lifetime or be discharged after one day. If they fall behind the lead, the leading opposition member replaces them.

This makes for certain things. It is possible to "signal" by turning off the vote for a day then turning it on.

Another wrinkle is that there is always a power behind the throne, because no cabinet member can afford to permanently campaign. They are the ones who lead the biggest bloc. The daily business is conducted by the cabinet and ceremony by the head of state. But the most powerful is the one that can lock the votes. Until he no longer can.
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Old 04-04-2020, 10:44 PM   #629
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Imagine a hereditary aristocracy, with the inheritance rules being something fairly typical (oldest male offspring, oldest offspring period, choice of the noble which one gets it, etc.), but in a realm organized 'federally'. That is, say the kingdom is made up of, oh, 20 hereditary dukedoms. The monarchy, however, is not hereditary. Instead, whichever Duke is currently in control of the richest, most populous dukedom is also the monarch. This means that the monarchy is sort of hereditary...but that family can lose the crown if somebody else's dukedom surpasses theirs. Also, the powers of the monarch are enumerated and somewhat limited.

To preserve the 'federal' character of the state, the 20 noble families are forbidden to marry each other. That's the first twist. It's set up so that there's no legal way to combine a dukedom or for one family to rule more than one (other than by winning the crown).

Each duke is near-absolute in his dukedom, but freedom of movement is mandated. Thus, a duke who is oppressive or incompetent may lose subjects to other dukes, and with it his chances for the crown. The subjects can 'vote with their feet', in other words.
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Old 04-05-2020, 12:47 PM   #630
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Default Re: Exotic Governmental/Legal Systems

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Originally Posted by Johnny1A.2 View Post
Imagine a hereditary aristocracy, with the inheritance rules being something fairly typical (oldest male offspring, oldest offspring period, choice of the noble which one gets it, etc.), but in a realm organized 'federally'. That is, say the kingdom is made up of, oh, 20 hereditary dukedoms. The monarchy, however, is not hereditary. Instead, whichever Duke is currently in control of the richest, most populous dukedom is also the monarch. This means that the monarchy is sort of hereditary...but that family can lose the crown if somebody else's dukedom surpasses theirs. Also, the powers of the monarch are enumerated and somewhat limited.

To preserve the 'federal' character of the state, the 20 noble families are forbidden to marry each other. That's the first twist. It's set up so that there's no legal way to combine a dukedom or for one family to rule more than one (other than by winning the crown).

Each duke is near-absolute in his dukedom, but freedom of movement is mandated. Thus, a duke who is oppressive or incompetent may lose subjects to other dukes, and with it his chances for the crown. The subjects can 'vote with their feet', in other words.

Is there a lower level aristocracy to provide consorts?

Actually this would combine well with polygamy. Each Duke must be of higher class than any potential consort unless he marries a foreigner. And the most convenient way to get the support of any influential family is to make them all your cousins (that is an old story). Any given duke or duchess (unless they practice Agnatic Succession) could support several spouses.
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