Duplication with multiplication

[starslayer]

Lets assume that a character has Duplication, with the multiplication modifier, and some levels of signature gear.

Can they do non-combat crafting actions where there extra number of bodies directly translates to stronger result; Say, RPM charm/hanging ritual creation, enchanting, ritual magic?

If they have item duplication do ALL of the duplicates effectively have another item, or just the 'core' ones that represent the level of the advantage (Important if say the super in question has 'Signature gear 20 point powerstone', or 'disposable signature gear 10 points of magical essence')

+20% seems pretty inexpensive for what could be a radical increase in the power of Q&D enchantment or massive increases in RPM reserve.

[Kalzazz]

I didn't think the character in question had any signature gear, just mundane gear

[starslayer]

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

I didn't think the character in question had any signature gear, just mundane gear

Only signature gear is copied with the Duplicated Gear enhancement. There is no enhancement to copy mundane gear. See main book pg 51

Originally Posted by Basic Set pg 51

Your Dupes
appear with copies of Signature Gear
(p. 85) that you are carrying or wear-
ing. Duplicated equipment vanishes
when you merge, even if it becomes
separated from you. Treat your equip-
ment’s HP, ammunition, energy sup-
ply, etc. just like your own HP and FP
when you merge. +100%.

[Mistofshadows]

Pg. 51 duplication entry in the main book.

"each possessing your full
knowledge and powers (but not copies
of your equipment, unless you buy a
special enhancement)."

One can assume the item upgrade fixes that... because if not then there isn't one...

Of course... the item enhancement is 100% !

100% would be the same cost for cosmic ignore stupid... copies all items.

My take on things is that the item is just mentioning that yes it copies signature gear... but if not then hey, it's sure as hell isn't worth 100%

[Kromm]

Originally Posted by starslayer

Can they do non-combat crafting actions where there extra number of bodies directly translates to stronger result; Say, RPM charm/hanging ritual creation, enchanting, ritual magic?

I would say "no" to that at +20%. If you can't learn faster, then more complex mental task shouldn't speed up, either. I'd impose the same conditions as for the Super-Speed enhancement on Altered Time Rate: You can't hasten learning, special abilities (making magic items, concentrating on Mind Control, etc.), or Concept rolls when inventing.

Originally Posted by starslayer

If they have item duplication do ALL of the duplicates effectively have another item, or just the 'core' ones that represent the level of the advantage (Important if say the super in question has 'Signature gear 20 point powerstone', or 'disposable signature gear 10 points of magical essence')

If you have both Duplicated Gear, +100% and Multiplication, +20%, then they "stack," as nothing in the description of either modifier says they shouldn't. Thus, non-combat Dupes appear with Signature Gear.

However, Duplicated Gear says "Signature Gear" and not "all gear." Duplication very specifically says "not copies of your equipment" and offers no modifier that changes that for anything but Signature Gear. That's intentional . . . If you want to duplicate gear, you need an expensive modifier and gear that costs points.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by starslayer

+20% seems pretty inexpensive for what could be a radical increase in the power of Q&D enchantment or massive increases in RPM reserve.

It's a tough call. Certainly, having a bunch of Duplicates would allow you to craft more quickly - if you need 80 man-hours to make a sword, it makes sense that someone with 7 dupes could make it in only 10 (plus an extra day or so for cooling off). On the other hand, Duplication allowing you to enchant far more rapidly can mean things that should normally be off-limits can become available (that is, you can use Q&D to enchant something that should be reliant on Slow and Sure).

I'd probably rule that Duplication can make you faster, but not more competent. So, for RPM (which I'm more familiar with), that guy and his 7 dupes could work together on a single ritual. However, the total energy they can pump into it from internal reserves and voluntary sacrifice shouldn't exceed what the actual character could manage on his own. Additionally, while each caster gets a roll every 5 minutes (or 5 seconds with Ritual Adept), every third roll total incurs the iterative penalty. So, if the guy has Magery 6, and thus Mana Reserve 18, he could pump a total of 18 mana into the spell from reserve (although he can have his dupes supply this instead of needing to do so himself, assuming they don't share resources), then start gathering. Five minutes (or seconds) later, he and his first dupe roll at full skill, then dupes 2-4 roll at -1, then dupes 5-7 roll at -2. Five minutes (or seconds) after that, he and dupes 1 and 2 roll at -3, dupes 3-5 roll at -4, dupes 6 and 7 roll at -5, and so forth.
It's a little hairier when considering voluntary sacrifice, as technically the character could sacrifice up to 6xHP in HP, 1xFP in FP, but spreading that amongst his dupes isn't nearly as damaging. For simplicity, I'd probably only let the actual character do voluntary sacrifice.

[Bruno]

Originally Posted by Varyon

It's a tough call. Certainly, having a bunch of Duplicates would allow you to craft more quickly - if you need 80 man-hours to make a sword, it makes sense that someone with 7 dupes could make it in only 10 (plus an extra day or so for cooling off).

Only if the work is something that can be done by multiple people at a time. You can get away with 2 dupes letting you do three shifts a day if you sleep on schedules, but there's often a strict maximum on the number of people that can work on a given task. Your extra dupes would be helpful as skilled assistants, but those are generally assumed for work like sword-smithing, I thought.

"9 mothers can't deliver a baby in one month" is true for more than maternity.

[Mistofshadows]

Hmm that means that duplicates are walking around naked... great. Ah well, such is life I guess.

[Kalzazz]

I would check out the Costume perk, I think it works with duplicates

[simply Nathan]

Signature Gear: Clothes is 1 point in pretty close to any TL.

Actually, even at TL0 50% of the standard $250 starting wealth is $125, which is a little more than the $120 for a set of ordinary clothes...so just make a distinct outfit your signature gear.

Or the Costume Perk.