Basic/Magic: casting with HP

philosophyguy · 10-01-2015, 02:35 PM

I'm confused on how the rules for energy costs function when using HP to power spells, and specifically how the shock-like penalty for using HP functions.

Because the penalty applies to the spell roll (B237), it seems like the energy cost needs to be paid before making the roll. But, on B325, it says to mark off the spell cost after making the roll. On a critical success, there's no cost, and on an ordinary failure the cost is only 1. So, the cost of the spell won't be known until after the spell roll.

So, what happens when a character needs to pay part of the spell cost in HP? Let's say that the character attempts a 1 energy spell at base skill 15, paying with HP, and rolls a 5.

If the HP penalty is applied beforehand, then the character gets an ordinary success. But, without the penalty, the roll would be a critical success and there would be no energy cost, so there's no HP spent and no penalty would apply.

The situation with the success/failure line is more complicated but just as confusing. Suppose our character is attempting a 5 energy spell at skill 15, paying with HP, and rolls a 13. With the HP penalty, effective skill is at 10 and so the spell fails, which means the character would only spend 1 HP. But then why does the character have a penalty for 4 HP that were never spent—which in this case means the difference between success and failure?

Imion · 10-01-2015, 03:01 PM

The reduction of cost is based on your base skill, not the effective skill you roll against.

For example: Your charcter knows Walk on Air at a base skill of 15. That means the cost to cast the spell is reduced from 3 to 2, to maintain from 2 to 1.

If you burn HP to pay for the spell the penalty affects your effective skill.

For example: Your character knows Walk on Air at a base skill level of 15. You choose to burn 2 HP to cast it (the spell costs only 2 FP/HP to cast due to the base skill level being 15). You now roll against 13 to cast it.

In case of a critical success I'd say tough luck. You have drawn energy directly from your body/life force/etc by burning HP. That you did not need it after all does not matter and you still have lost those HP. YMMV.

panton41 · 10-01-2015, 07:35 PM

For a moment I thought this was an alternate magic using HP instead of FP to cast. It reminded me of a thought experiment Orson Scott Card mentioned in a book called, "How to Write Science Fiction and Fantasy." You needed to at least bleed to cast spells, bigger sacrifices were needed for bigger spells and the most powerful of wizards had missing digits and limbs.

10-01-2015, 02:35 PM	#1
philosophyguy Join Date: Feb 2014	Basic/Magic: casting with HP I'm confused on how the rules for energy costs function when using HP to power spells, and specifically how the shock-like penalty for using HP functions. Because the penalty applies to the spell roll (B237), it seems like the energy cost needs to be paid before making the roll. But, on B325, it says to mark off the spell cost after making the roll. On a critical success, there's no cost, and on an ordinary failure the cost is only 1. So, the cost of the spell won't be known until after the spell roll. So, what happens when a character needs to pay part of the spell cost in HP? Let's say that the character attempts a 1 energy spell at base skill 15, paying with HP, and rolls a 5. If the HP penalty is applied beforehand, then the character gets an ordinary success. But, without the penalty, the roll would be a critical success and there would be no energy cost, so there's no HP spent and no penalty would apply. The situation with the success/failure line is more complicated but just as confusing. Suppose our character is attempting a 5 energy spell at skill 15, paying with HP, and rolls a 13. With the HP penalty, effective skill is at 10 and so the spell fails, which means the character would only spend 1 HP. But then why does the character have a penalty for 4 HP that were never spent—which in this case means the difference between success and failure?

10-01-2015, 03:01 PM	#2
Imion Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Germany	Re: Basic/Magic: casting with HP The reduction of cost is based on your base skill, not the effective skill you roll against. For example: Your charcter knows Walk on Air at a base skill of 15. That means the cost to cast the spell is reduced from 3 to 2, to maintain from 2 to 1. If you burn HP to pay for the spell the penalty affects your effective skill. For example: Your character knows Walk on Air at a base skill level of 15. You choose to burn 2 HP to cast it (the spell costs only 2 FP/HP to cast due to the base skill level being 15). You now roll against 13 to cast it. In case of a critical success I'd say tough luck. You have drawn energy directly from your body/life force/etc by burning HP. That you did not need it after all does not matter and you still have lost those HP. YMMV. __________________ Feel free to add 'IMO' where appropriate.