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Old 02-07-2016, 12:10 AM   #31
ghostofjfd
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Atlanta, GA
Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

1. from 5.05:
For instance, a regular GEV has a movement of 4-3.
Unless the countermix includes some GEV-PCs or such, it's fine and maybe clearer to omit "regular" here.

2. doubled punctuation in the Mark III Attack scneario, p. 3:
the safer it is!.
3. Consider changing the heading of Section 2.0 to "Map" since there is only one.
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Old 02-07-2016, 10:45 AM   #32
wolf90
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

Maybe this only bothers me, but I'm going to keep pointing it out:

* Page 4, "Mark III Defending", the words "areas" and "area" should be capitalized.
* Page 4, "GEV Escort", second bullet, the word "area" should be capitalized.

The regions on the map are established as "North Area, Central Area and South Area" on page 3 in "Mark III Attack", so when referring to these regions on page 4, they should all be capitalized. Alternatively, remove the capital "A's" from page 3 and elsewhere on page 4. Consistency is the issue…

In a similar vein (although more trivial than above):

* Page 4, "GEV Escort", first bullet, instead of stating "bottom of the map", it would be more consistent with other passages to state "south end of the map", which is used in multiple other areas.

And then another question re: the problematic section 4.02:

* Page 7, bullet 2 of section 4.02, should there be a parenthetical comment to "(see Section 6)" regarding rams? You have a parenthetical remark for a lesser issue in the passage. I think a cleaner sentence would be "If any unit enters an enemy-occupied hex, creating a ram situation, immediately resolve the ram attack (see Section 6)." But again, this is somewhat trivial...

D.
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Old 02-07-2016, 10:53 AM   #33
HeatDeath
 
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

The rulebook should contain a sidebar, or better yet, the box should contain an insert, that heavily promotes the upcoming expansion, the GEV map set, the ODE extra counter set, the Classic Counters set, the sponsored counter sheets, and above all the Ogre Scenario Book PDF and Ogre Book PDF.

Come to think of it, the announcement should contain these links too. The opportunity to clear a significant stock of ODE-related inventory is just too great [and is no doubt at least a small part of the business case for producing the new box].

Last edited by HeatDeath; 02-07-2016 at 11:09 AM.
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Old 02-07-2016, 03:06 PM   #34
ghostofjfd
 
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

I agree with wolf90 about the "south" instead of the "bottom" edge of the map.

The announcement mentions the Ogres and their four GEV in one color scheme and the defenders in another. This is a friendly reminder to check the countermix. The "Mark III Defending" scenario (p. 4) calls for Ogres in the attacker's and defender's colors. The "Ogre Defending" scenario (also p. 4) will have armor in excess of four GEVs on each side.
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Old 02-07-2016, 08:32 PM   #35
Steve Jackson
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

Thank you all. Keep them coming.

Updated PDF posted, but no need to download it again - it's identical in the first 12 pages and the rest are deleted.

Which leads me to ask - should I post a revision after these things are dealt with?

I will definitely - after a few more days have passed - post a long Comment on Comments!
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Old 02-07-2016, 09:41 PM   #36
HeatDeath
 
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

I think, modulo production timeframes and deadlines, that more revision passes can only be helpful. There does come a point where you are over-polishing, but the text is a ways from being there yet.
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Old 02-08-2016, 10:05 AM   #37
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ldj00 View Post
But multiple players does not mean multiple factions.

Those two Mark IIIs are still on the same side and same faction, working in concert, so the rules of Section 4.04 do not really apply.
That's not necessarily true. It's easily extensible to competing factions, and you are also assuming that only the scenarios in the book will ever be played. There's a whole universe of options for scenarios that are specifically multi-faction, even if it's just getting that third friend in on the action, that make having 4.04 important to state how that should be handled.
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Old 02-08-2016, 11:16 AM   #38
dwalend
 
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson View Post
This new set is for all those people who would have bought the ODE if they’d found out in time, and all the people who have learned to play from their friends with the ODE and want their own copy, and all the kids who don’t play wargames yet, but when they’re a bit older, YOU will teach them.
Quote:
As you’ll see, this was created by cutting down the ODE rules, so there may still be some orphan mentions of (for instance) overrun attacks.
This might not be quite the feedback you're after, but - Why not just include the ODE Rulebook?

First off, the overrun rules are really amazingly good; they go hand-in-hand with stacking and spillover, a solid triad.

Second, for $50 send them a few extra sheets of paper with the full rules.

Third, if this version is for people who want Ogre, but missed the kickstarter, then it is for some of the people who are going to buy Assault Packs, expansions, and extra maps. Without a full set of rules SJGames gets into this weird area of "If you have Ogre - Merely Huge Edition - then you need some extra rules along with the other boxes. (No good way around this for the maps. Also, one of the Assault Packs uses the tan map but full rules.)

Forth, it saves production effort that could be used for something else (although you've started down the path already).

I bought two ODEs, pulled one apart into "just Ogre" and have it in a lap top box ready to carry. I'm really glad to see Ogre as a possible product in its own box. I think it makes a lot of sense.

Last edited by dwalend; 02-09-2016 at 08:50 PM.
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Old 02-09-2016, 10:33 AM   #39
offsides
 
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwalend View Post
This might not be quite the feedback you're after, but - Why not just include the ODE Rulebook?
The one reason I can see not to do this is that by keeping the rules to Ogre only, it allows the game to stand on its own regardless of whether or not other supplements remain in print. It would certainly be worth mentioning that the expanded rules PDF is available for free at W23, but including rules that talk about things that may or may not (and in the case of the full ODE, definitely not) be available as though they're part of the core product might not go over as well.

I personally wouldn't have a problem with it (perhaps a revised edition, taking into account previous errata/suggestions/FAQ along with whatever has been spotted here), but I'm not very good at marketing so I'll leave that to the professionals :)
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Old 02-09-2016, 10:37 AM   #40
offsides
 
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Default Re: Soft announcement: new Ogre set!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson View Post
Which leads me to ask - should I post a revision after these things are dealt with?
Given that Real Life(tm) has intruded on my ability to go over the rules, it would certainly be easier for me if I didn't have to consult all the details people have posted already. Plus, since some of these are judgment calls on your part, it would be good to see what you decide on just in case it somehow triggers confusion or the like. Either way, I look forward to your replies!
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