Shapeshifter's and the CP cost of Toasters

[Crystalline_Entity]

I'm sure there was an "electronic device" template in Pyramid somewhere, I'll try and find it, that might be a good order-of-magnitude estimate for a toaster.

Edit: Found it, "typical electronics" from Pyramid 3/46 Weird Science, is -642 points. Note it does have IQ bought down to zero, so a sapient toaster would need that buying back, plus some sort of burning attack.

[James P]

Originally Posted by Crystalline_Entity

Edit: Found it, "typical electronics" from Pyramid 3/46 Weird Science, is -642 points. Note it does have IQ bought down to zero, so a sapient toaster would need that buying back, plus some sort of burning attack.

Thank you, that is incredibly helpful!

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by James P

2. Even if a toaster were given -50 CP, I'm assuming you would have to add a pool of 50 Points to your Shapeshifting, if you wanted to have human IQ, while in that form. Because assuming "toaster" status, without, would be the same as saying, "I'm going to permanently lobotomize myself". So a toaster that can think normally would require Shapeshifting 150 pts?

When the GM designs these sorts of templates, they should generally leave the mental stats alone (depending on the shapeshifting lore, of course). That means that shape-shifters are usually adopting high IQ versions of their chosen form. Its no different with a toaster: you don't have to pay extra points to have IQ10 while a toaster, you just have to have a toaster template that ignores mental attributes.


It gets dicier and closer with animal templates than with toaster templates: those are easier to end over 0 points with. but...

Originally Posted by Sam Baughn

Write up meta-traits for 'homogenous object', 'immobile object', and 'portable object'. Use those along with the machine meta-trait and the vehicle body meta-traits from Template Toolkit 2 and you have some very simple building blocks to make a racial template from. The only characteristics which really matter are ST, HP, SM and Move. The first three are pretty easy to look up on a table, while the last only really matters for vehicles and can be found in the vehicle stats. After that you need to know what DR they have (almost always 2-3 for normal machines) and any Enhanced Move (again, only for vehicles and hopefully obvious from vehicle stats). Ignore any other traits and you can knock out a racial template in minutes.
For inanimate objects you can save even more time by just defining the largest thing they can afford and assuming anything smaller is OK.
I'd force the player who took the advantage to do it, because that's still a lot of work if they use it frequently, especially with vehicles.

This is a great idea, but I just want to say we could absolutely do this right here:


Shapeshifter as Homogeneous Object [-265]:
ST 0 [-100]
DX 0 [-200]


speed +0 [50]



Doesn't breathe [20]
Immune to Metebolic Hazards [30]
Injury Tolerance (Homogenous, No Blood) [45]
No Legs (Portable) [-30]
No Manipulators [-50]



*******************************
Note that this form lets you see, feel, listen, think, and react as you would normally. This is intentional. It doesn't include DR or HP, which should be added for each object. These are the stats for an object: a machine drops injury tolerance from Homogenous to Unliving.

[James P]

Originally Posted by ericthered

When the GM designs these sorts of templates, they should generally leave the mental stats alone (depending on the shapeshifting lore, of course). That means that shape-shifters are usually adopting high IQ versions of their chosen form. Its no different with a toaster: you don't have to pay extra points to have IQ10 while a toaster, you just have to have a toaster template that ignores mental attributes.

....

Note that this form lets you see, feel, listen, think, and react as you would normally. This is intentional. It doesn't include DR or HP, which should be added for each object. These are the stats for an object: a machine drops injury tolerance from Homogenous to Unliving.

Aaaand anther variation that is nearly perfect!

Thanks, again!

If nothing else, posting questions like this helps a lot by simply reminding me to keep if f-ing simple!

[cvannrederode]

Originally Posted by Crystalline_Entity

I'm sure there was an "electronic device" template in Pyramid somewhere, I'll try and find it, that might be a good order-of-magnitude estimate for a toaster.

Edit: Found it, "typical electronics" from Pyramid 3/46 Weird Science, is -642 points. Note it does have IQ bought down to zero, so a sapient toaster would need that buying back, plus some sort of burning attack.

Template Toolkit 2 includes meta-traits for vehicles, both being a Vehicle itself (a meta-trait that is -190pts), as well as 'morphology' like "Wheeled Vehicle" or "Helicopter".

The example racial templates includes the Dayton-Wright DH-4, at -79 points. Of course, there's a lot you'd have to buy off (IQ 0, insensate, non-autonomous, fixed-IQ, etc, etc).

Also, Transhuman space: Changing times includes Stats for computers (just the physical box itself) as cybershells, so there's some fodder for adjustment there).

[James P]

Originally Posted by cvannrederode

Template Toolkit 2 includes meta-traits for vehicles...

Thank you, as well.

[Inky]

That template has 0 HP, as written, unless I've forgotten how that works, which might be relevant if something hits it. Of course, it probably doesn't matter, since we've established that it has such a low point value that adding some HP is unlikely to take it over the more-points-than-the-PC's-usual-state threshold, which seems to be all that matters for this purpose.

It can also still talk, as written. That may be what you want to do, of course.