05-13-2018, 04:56 PM | #31 | |
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Tyler, Texas
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak - Last second twist.
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For my game, the name started as a joke, then I kept it because I liked it. And it suggested the title of the sequel - For a Few TOWs More. |
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05-13-2018, 06:54 PM | #32 |
Banned
Join Date: Mar 2018
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
TY I just watched a nearly 20 minute first impression report on YouTube about your game, wherein the guy featured your hardbound rulebook for TOWs3. Very complimentary:"...468 pages, and not one of those pages is wasted...". Nice.
TY can we get a "weigh-in" from you on the "De-Fang the pole-weapon" and "Option II c: Defend" concepts which KIRK and I are exploring? Thanks. JK Last edited by Jim Kane; 05-14-2018 at 02:32 PM. Reason: Typo |
05-15-2018, 04:11 PM | #33 | |
Join Date: May 2015
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
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As for moving 1/2 MA (like 1.3 meters per second - "charging?") and Defending being a "tough move" - why would that be any harder than moving and attacking? Yes, the way Defend merely raises the roll on the attacker's DX to 4 dice and doesn't scale with defender's ability at all, gets overpowered by high DX and becomes a non-issue. Works ok for 32-point fighters, but less and less well as high DX gets involved. |
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05-15-2018, 04:25 PM | #34 | |||
Join Date: May 2015
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
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I think it's ok for beginning point characters, but becomes increasingly less satisfactory against higher-DX pole-weapon-users (i.e. high level characters, as the attacker chances increase without regard to the defender's skill). Last edited by Skarg; 05-15-2018 at 04:44 PM. |
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05-15-2018, 04:36 PM | #35 | ||
Join Date: May 2015
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
Or just read the Changing Options rule and realize it already is an option.
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So Klem: ST 11 Shortsword 2d-1 DX 13(12) Large Shield (2) -1 DX being charged by a spear will take an average of 5 hits from a one-handed spear, or 7 from a 2-handed spear. Still bad news, but not as bad as you were calculating. And the non-charge damage comparison becomes more like 2d-1 versus 1d-1, or 2d-2 versus 1d-2 (depending on whether the spear guy has a small shield or not). Last edited by Skarg; 05-15-2018 at 04:40 PM. |
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05-15-2018, 05:02 PM | #36 |
Join Date: Feb 2018
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
Yep, I donīt have easy access to my rulebooks and was remembering when we played in college, where spears were 1+2, then doubled for charge attacks.
Later additions seem to tone it down just a bit, to 1+1, making sword options slightly more viable vs. pole weapons. The way we read the rules, you can't change your option until it is time for you to act, depending on what has happened and how far you moved. As a by product, this keeps things from becoming chaotic if anyone can change their option at any time during the turn. So interpreted that way, not having a specific Move 1/2 and Defend option for an unengaged character moving against a pole weapon means that he is going to go first, and you just impaled yourself, without the benefit of even 4 dice to be hit. And I think SJ meant it to be that way, charging up against a pole weapon then suddenly trying to defend seems to defy momentum. I do wish SJ would clarify how and when one can change an action (and consider the consequences if done differently than the way we read the rules), including which DX changes affect order of execution and which do not. What I don't think works well is just bringing down the double damage to adding a die etc., which of course also weights things like javelins and spears over the larger pole weapons. |
05-15-2018, 05:15 PM | #37 | ||
Join Date: May 2015
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
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05-15-2018, 05:42 PM | #38 |
Join Date: Feb 2018
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
The way we see the rules is that (4) Actions follow (3) Movement, and the Changing Options sections states that you can change option after the movement part of a turn, therefore being in the Actions part of the turn, in which characters act in order of their DX.
When they therefore can Act, they can change the Action part of their option if it doesn't violate the movement requirement of the option they chose in the Movement portion of the turn. If you can indeed change options without respect to DX as you say, why choose an option at all? What is the point? Why not just move and be done with it? Additionally, as a practical aspect, what characters choose to do can alter their position in the now vague *order* of Actions. If I throw a bola, I get +2, but if I decide to attack with my sword, I don't. But then if I do that, my opponent changes his option to defend, then the wizard switches to a spell of clumsiness, which makes me slower, so I decide to throw the bola, and on and on. I see nowhere a limit to the number of times someone can change their option, either, only that it is done after the Movement phase and it has to meet the movement requirement, and that they only end up executing one Action in the end. |
05-15-2018, 06:12 PM | #39 | |
Banned
Join Date: Mar 2018
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
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Option II c: Dodge Perhaps on the re-print, SJ might change it to: Options II c: Dodge or Defend Or perhaps as KIRK and I were wondering if there was some other reason why it only offers Dodge as an Option on the list JK |
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05-15-2018, 06:31 PM | #40 | |||||
Join Date: May 2015
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Re: Movement Rule Tweak
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1) You don't generally particularly need to declare an option during Movement, if you know the rules well enough. But the amount you move will dictate what you can do during the Action phase. I think it' mainly explained that you do it this way, to help new players learn what you will be able to do if you move 1, up to 1/2 MA, or up to full MA. 2) If you want to start by committing to Dodge or Defend right from the start (might be useful if you think you may be about to be attacked by someone you wouldn't even be aware of - an arrow from behind, maybe? Or to hope it gets foes to choose to avoid you and attack someone else?). 3) You want to help communicate other players what your intention is, so they can coordinate with you. 4) So the GM can correct you if you make a mistake (e.g. you say you mean to Attack but you move 4 and your MA is 6 - the GM could catch it and let you move one less instead of telling you later you can't attack). Quote:
(When would it end? GM: Who's next? Ok, next we have Sally if she's aiming at Klogg and not making an Aimed Shot at anyone withing 2 megahexes, or Boris if he's throwing an axe at anyone at range 4 or less. Or Samuel if he's throwing his magic +1 DX spear at anyone at range 6 or less (or if he's throwing a non-magical weapon at anyone at range 5 or less), or David if he's attacking that orc lying on the ground at +4. Any of you who want to do that, roll one die to see who actually goes next...) Quote:
If the wizard then casts a spell, that would be at a later place in the action sequence, because it was your turn to act, and will be too late to affect your action. Quote:
As each player's turn to act comes, they commit to an action and a target. People can change their option in reaction to that (mainly the only reason to do so at that point would be for the target of an attack that is happening to Defend or Dodge against that attack - if they do, they've committed to that option for the rest of the turn). Then the next figure to act commits to an action. That's about it. It's really very simple. Even reacting to an attack by changing to Dodge or Defend is pretty rare, because mostly fighters want to Attack not Defend, and people who want to Dodge or Defend usually figure that out by the end of the Movement phase anyway. |
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