Why isn't GURPS as popular as the D20 system and games

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Whome?

Sadly, D20 as a generic RPG has kinda gone away. Many companies have left it. So much stuff has gone away - totally out of print.

AFAICT their licenses expired with the new edition.

The new DnD 4e was apart of this - I'm pretty sure.

I don't think so, the new logo is actually a different trademark and they aren't licensing it under the same terms as they did the "d20 System", AFAICT. The OGL is definitely gone, nothing like an SRD exists for the new rules.

DnD 4e I actually like - but it is basically a miniatures combat/roleplaying game - not like the old game really.

Hasn't D&D always been a miniatures combat/roleplaying game?

[Johnny Angel]

While I enjoy hardbound books most, I wouldn't mind seeing a few more soft cover GURPS books. I really have no idea how much more (if at all) cost effective that may be though.

[rust]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

The OGL is definitely gone ...

The OGL still exists, it cannot be revoked, and Drive Thru RPG still has more
than 4,800 PDFs available for the d20/OGL 3rd Edition, some of them publi-
shed recently, so I would not call the system "gone". :)

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by rust

The OGL still exists, it cannot be revoked, and Drive Thru RPG still has more
than 4,800 PDFs available for the d20/OGL 3rd Edition, some of them publi-
shed recently, so I would not call the system "gone". :)

You are correct and they do maintain the old 3.5 SRD on their site. They aren't otherwise supporting it any longer, however.

The new GSL is very different from the OGL and the new SRD isn't a playable rules system but merely a list of page references in the D&D core rules that are available for licensee use.

[rust]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

They aren't otherwise supporting it any longer, however.

I even suspect that WotC's decision to make their own PDFs of d20 3rd Edi-
tion material unavailable had at least as much to do with an attempt to elimi-
nate the "in house competition" for D&D 4 as with the piracy problem mentio-
ned as their reason.

[sir_pudding]

By "the OGL is gone" I meant that there is no equivalent for the new "d20 System". If you think there is, try to run a game using nothing but the new SRD. The new "d20 System" isn't functionally the same system the OP was trolling for.

[rust]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

By "the OGL is gone" I meant that there is no equivalent for the new "d20 System". If you think there is, try to run a game using nothing but the new SRD. The new "d20 System" isn't functionally the same system the OP was trolling for.

Yep, I agree completely.

[Mylon]

There is no 4th edition d20 SRD, no. However, given the nature of the SRD/OGL of 3.5 edition d20, any sufficiently strong publisher could pick it up and run with it much like how Paizo has made off with Pathfinder. I find this particularly amusing because when the OGL was explained, they addressed the question of, "Couldn't someone publish and sell the SRD?" And the answer was yes, they could, but who would pay for it if it already existed for free? The point wasn't so much that people wouldn't buy it, but that it could still be sold. And with the official abandonment for 3.5, a market gap has opened.

New name, some slight updates to the rules, republish and prosper.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Mylon

There is no 4th edition d20 SRD, no. However, given the nature of the SRD/OGL of 3.5 edition d20, any sufficiently strong publisher could pick it up and run with it much like how Paizo has made off with Pathfinder.

New name, some slight updates to the rules, republish and prosper.

Paizo had to get a special license to have character generation and advancement rules, IIRC. At any rate, are you saying that Pathfinder is more popular than GURPS?

EDIT: And there is a 4e SRD. I linked to it upthread. The GSL is a much more traditional case by case license. AFAICT the SRD is a list of things that WotC might allow a license to use.

[Mylon]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

Paizo had to get a special license to have character generation and advancement rules, IIRC. At any rate, are you saying that Pathfinder is more popular than GURPS?

EDIT: And there is a 4e SRD. I linked to it upthread. The GSL is a much more traditional case by case license. AFAICT the SRD is a list of things that WotC might allow a license to use.

No, I'm just saying that Pathfinder is a curious case of 3.5 outliving it's official support. In theory, the generic d20 system for use in modern campaigns or whatever could be picked up similarly. I am curious about how Pathfinder is licensed... Given how the XP table and point buy system is different (And I think point buy is the standard now), they could claim original work on that. I'd have to check if there's a d20 stamp on it.

The 4th edition SRD is useless in comparison. Possibly useful as a reference guide or some kind of universal index, but it's not a standalone document.