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Old 07-11-2020, 07:25 AM   #21
maximara
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Default Re: Magic Attribute

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Originally Posted by Anaraxes View Post
I expect that's meant to count as "standard" Magery. I think the point of that line is that -- despite the name -- RPM-Magery is not the same Advantage as Basic-Magery, and that the benefits of one should not be assumed to be provided by the other form.
The problem is the enhancement/limitation "Functions as a Different Talent: [0%]" All forms of Magery avoe 0 with this enhancement/limitation are not same Advantage. The best example is

Magery (Functions as a Different Talent ±0%; Sanctity Replaces Mana: ±0%; No Zero-Level Requirement +10%; Inspired Learning +20%; No Spell Prerequisites +30%; Pact -10%; No Magic Item Sensitivity -20%; Limited spell list -30%)

This thing is so different it has another name: Power Investiture

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Originally Posted by Anaraxes View Post
There's a "Mixing Magic Systems" box in the book that goes into a little more detail on how to have standard Magic and RPM coexist in the same game, if you're so inclined. The gist is imply that it's two different systems.
I get that. But thanks to enhancements and limitations you can turn Magery into something that is effectively a different system so this doesn't deal with the problem.

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Originally Posted by Anaraxes View Post
In hindsight, they probably should have just made up a different name just for that clarity, despite all the similarity in purpose and character build role of the two Advantages.
Except it expressly states "This is a variant of standard Magery" which per the Power Investiture example should be replicable with the right enhancements and limitations.

This causes another problem; the way Ritual Path is written it does not follow the rules set forth in Thaumatology.

For example "Magery 0 grants no other benefits – it cannot detect magic, etc" but Limited Magery 0 in Thaumatology (pg 21) expressly states that this is No Magic Item Sensitivity (-20%) that must be specifically applied to Magery 0 otherwise Magery 0 functions normally.

By this rule Magery (Ritual Path) 0 should be 4 points not the 5 that is implied unless it is offset by an equal enhancement but it is unclear just what that enhancement is.

To paraphrase Sir Arthur Conan-Doyle 'we got there but we didn't get an explanation on how we got there'
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Old 07-11-2020, 08:38 AM   #22
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Default Re: Magic Attribute

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Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
Also, there can be uses of Power other than spellcasting. If these matter to non-casters, then letting everyone lower Power becomes fairer.
Another easy way to make Power matter to non-casters is to have magic items require a certain minimum Power score to activate. The majority of simple and easy to acquire magic items might have a requirement of 9-10, more complex and/or uncommon items could be in the 11-13 range and intricate or legendary stuff would be in the 15-20 range.

Sure, a +1 sword might respond to nearly everyone, but a +2 Dragonslayer sword needs a more heroic figure while Excalibur can only be wielded by the most powerful heroes. Or an Ever Burning Torch (Power 9) vs a Wand of Fireballs (Power 12) vs a Wand of the Inferno (Power 15).

In this setup Power represents how attuned a character is to the flow of magic in general, and magical items require a certain amount of this flow to function. I would let players purchase 1 or 2 levels of "Flow" above their Power at character creation, to represent an improved ability to channel magic into/through items but not through self (and also let Warrior McBeef use a better magic sword without purchasing full levels of Power). I'm not sure how much I'd charge for Flow. Even if 2/level might feel fair for something that "doesn't do much", I feel like that's an easy -2 Power/+2 Flow for -16 total (if Power is 10/level) without doing much to penalize a starting non-caster character. Depending on opportunities for improving Flow and loot acquired it could be an issue later on or it could simply just have been 16 free points.
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Old 07-11-2020, 09:13 AM   #23
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Default Re: Magic Attribute

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Originally Posted by WingedKagouti View Post

Another easy way to make Power matter to non-casters is to have magic items require a certain minimum Power score to activate.
That's a cool idea that could get rid of the binary "Usable only by mages." that so many people dislike. Some function of prerequisite count would probably make the most sense. Reading "yards" as "prerequisites" on p. B550 to get SM ("Why it was always Spell Minimum, never Size Modifier!"), and using 10+SM, for instance. I'm not even sure I'd have a problem with Great Wish requiring Power 18 to be useful.
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Old 07-11-2020, 10:01 AM   #24
AlexanderHowl
 
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Default Re: Magic Attribute

It may be worthwhile to allow individuals to enhance mundane items with Power Points. In effect, characters could commit PP to a mundane item in order to manifest an ability with a CP cost equal to the amount of PP committed (they would not benefit from gadget limitations though, as the character could simply commit the PP to other mundane items). Characters could commit up to (Power) PP divided among one or more items, with their remaining PP being reserve for extra effort and cinematic/supernatural abilities. The process of commitment would require a successful Meditation roll and one hour per PP committed (a process that could be unconscious).

For example, a professional boxer with Power 12 might have a prized pair of fighting gloves. With up to 12 PP to commit, the boxing gloves could give them Striking ST+6 (Single Attack, Punch, -60%) while they wear the boxing gloves. If the gloves are destroyed or stolen, they could reinvest the PP in another set with a successful Meditation roll and 12 hours to meditate.
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Old 07-11-2020, 10:37 AM   #25
maximara
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Default Re: Magic Attribute

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm View Post
That's a cool idea that could get rid of the binary "Usable only by mages." that so many people dislike. Some function of prerequisite count would probably make the most sense. Reading "yards" as "prerequisites" on p. B550 to get SM ("Why it was always Spell Minimum, never Size Modifier!"), and using 10+SM, for instance. I'm not even sure I'd have a problem with Great Wish requiring Power 18 to be useful.
Well GURPS Religion had "Magic items in shamanistic magic have inherent spiritual power, affecting anyone who uses or touches them. Such items are very rare, and always natural in origin, though they may have been reshaped by human hands."

The whole "Usable only by mages." thing is a relic from Classic when Magery 1 [15] was the lowest form of Magery one could formally get (Magery 0 was houserule back then)

Things have changed to the point where "Usable only by mages." isn't that powerful a limitation anymore.

Instead of creating something new let's look in the GURPS toolkit and see what "off the shelf" tools we can adapt.

Fractional Magery immediately comes to mind. Instead of being limited to Magery (Path/Book) open that rule to all forms of Magery.

Now "Usable only by mages" becomes "full power limited to Magery 0" with non-mages being at -5 to use the item - assuming they have an idea it is a magic item as whole detect magic item ability doesn't kick in until Fractional Magery 5.

This means a Power 15 item will cast spells as if it is Power 10 in their hands an each level of Fractional Magery removes a -1.
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Last edited by maximara; 07-11-2020 at 03:54 PM.
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