Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-21-2018, 07:51 AM   #1
RaposaViking
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Default Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

What happens with your spells if you are in different mana levels simultaniously? For exemple, if one character have Mana Dumper 2 with the Area Effect Enhancement on a normal mana setting area around him mana will decrease to no mana. Then a huge magical creature, such as a dragon partially enters this NMZ. Will he be able to cast spells? The lasting spells already cast on him goes off?
RaposaViking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2018, 08:25 AM   #2
Anaraxes
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Default Re: Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

I don't think there's RAW on exactly how multi-hex figures are affected by area effects. So, three obvious choices:

1) Pick a point to use to determine "in" or "out". This should be the head of a multi-hex figure, as that's the point used for other determinations in the rules. (It's also generally where the brain is, so it's not a terrible spot to pick for magic use.)

2) Worst case: the figure suffers the worst of any of multiple levels of the same effect it happens to be in. (In this case, that's the lowest mana area. So, if you're not completely suffused with a mana level, you can't cast spells at that mana level.)

3) Best case: the figure suffers the least of any of multiple levels of the same effect. (As long as any of your body is touching mana, you can draw on it. However, you likely want the same rules to apply to other areas like fire or explosions, so having a pinky sticking through a wall into the fire that kills you might be more annoying than refusing to let a mage stick their pinky into the high-mana zone in the next hex.)

If there's a dispute as to "best" and "worst" effect, read those as "player's choice" and "GM's choice". For the rules lawyers, I'd also throw in a clause into "choice" rules that said once that choice has been made for some figure, it remains consistent throughout the scene. (That is, you can't choose to be the in the normal-mana area to cast your spell, then on your foe's turn claim to be in the no-mana area so his spells can't affect you.)

You could also just go with (4) GM's ruling on the spot or (5) average the effects per hex and use that average.

Seems like the multi-hex creature vs. area effect question would be good oFAQ or certainly uFAQ material.
Anaraxes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2018, 01:43 PM   #3
Not another shrubbery
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Default Different Mana Levels (on multi-hex characters)

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaposaViking View Post
What happens with your spells if you are in different mana levels simultaniously? For exemple, if one character have Mana Dumper 2 with the Area Effect Enhancement on a normal mana setting area around him mana will decrease to no mana. Then a huge magical creature, such as a dragon partially enters this NMZ. Will he be able to cast spells? The lasting spells already cast on him goes off?
Gosh, that's a good question that sure seems like it ought to have been answered before... but I didn't turn anything up with a perfunctory search.
Anaraxes had some good suggestions. I might rule that for full-body buffing effects, only the parts of the body in the NMZ have the effect removed. Likewise, for spells that *only* affect a specific part of the body. A lot of spells (like any where the effect is "mental") would be negated if the head were in the NMZ. Casting a spell for someone straddling different mana levels looks like a GM call that just needs to be applied consistently, once made, but A's 1) looks like a reasonable ruling to play with.
Not another shrubbery is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2018, 02:44 PM   #4
evileeyore
 
evileeyore's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 100 hurricane swamp
Default Re: Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

I'd determine the percentage covered by the effects and round to the nearest whole. So if 5 out of 8 of it's hexes were in a Normal Mana Zone and the other 3 in a Low, they'd be treated as being in a Normal Mana Zone.

On a 50/50 split I'd average the effects and round down.

So if the multi-hex creature is half in a High Mana Zone and half in a Low Mana Zone, I'd call it Normal Mana. If half in a High and half in a No, call it Low and move along.
__________________
Feel free to steal, borrow, fold, spindle, mutilate any rule, advantage, etc I come up with it.
evileeyore is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-21-2018, 03:13 PM   #5
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: Different Mana Levels (on multi-hex characters)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Not another shrubbery View Post
Gosh, that's a good question that sure seems like it ought to have been answered before... but I didn't turn anything up with a perfunctory search.
Anaraxes had some good suggestions. I might rule that for full-body buffing effects, only the parts of the body in the NMZ have the effect removed. Likewise, for spells that *only* affect a specific part of the body. A lot of spells (like any where the effect is "mental") would be negated if the head were in the NMZ. Casting a spell for someone straddling different mana levels looks like a GM call that just needs to be applied consistently, once made, but A's 1) looks like a reasonable ruling to play with.
The head or the heart. That's the way I'd go.
David Johnston2 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2018, 12:36 PM   #6
Plane
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Default Re: Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

Enter the "No Head" + "No Vitals" mage...
Plane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2018, 06:58 PM   #7
Hide
 
Hide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Default Re: Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaposaViking View Post
What happens with your spells if you are in different mana levels simultaniously? For exemple, if one character have Mana Dumper 2 with the Area Effect Enhancement on a normal mana setting area around him mana will decrease to no mana. Then a huge magical creature, such as a dragon partially enters this NMZ. Will he be able to cast spells? The lasting spells already cast on him goes off?
Well, from my perspective, magic works like this: You cast a fire-bolt, you gather mana and you hurl a ball of fire; however, this ball of fire is plain regular fire. In other words, even if the origin of the fire is magical, the fire you cast is not different than fire from a common lighter.

On full exposure to mana damper:

Mana damper doesn’t stop/affect a fire-bolt when it enters the targeted area. The same principle would apply to “buff magic”. If you enter the mana damper area with a force-field-made-of-magic, it will last as much as the original spell states; but, if your whole body is inside the mana damper area, it will be impossible to keep it further than the spell’s duration (unless you leave the mana damper area).

In other words, mana damper doesn’t shut down spells you have already casted. But if such spells require upkeep, then it’s over unless you leave the mana damper area. This reasoning comes from my conception of spells and a paragraph in B67: “(…) a wizard could throw a fireball at you unhindered, but he would find it difficult to use magic to turn you to stone or read your mind (…)”.

On partial exposure to mana damper:

Partial exposure to a mana-damper area won’t cancel the magical creature’s buffs because the creature is still having access to mana. Also, IMO, it won’t prevent it from casting magic per-se... But It might have some disadvantages.

Let’s change the perspective, we employ oxygen to live, will you die if your body receives vacuum therapy (i.e. on patch of skin in your back)? Obviously not, partial exposure to vacuum is not the same a complete oxygen deprivation. Of course, you might have some difficulties, but it won’t completely “stop” you.

So, my solution would be looking at p. B235 and doing an average between the highest and the lowest mana levels (rounded down) accordingly to these values:

Very high mana: 4
High mana: 3
Normal mana: 2
Low mana: 1
No mana: 0 (or any negative values provided by mana damper or the like).

So, for example, if the magical dragon covers 4 hexes:

Hex 1: Mana 3
Hex 2: Mana 3
Hex 3: Mana 0
Hex 4: Mana 1

The mana level for the dragon will be “mana level 1”. In this situation, it works as being on a low-mana area, thus having a -5 to magic related skills (its spells won’t work if it lacks magery).

Or, for example, if the magical dragon covers 3 hexes:

Hex 1: Mana 2
Hex 2: Mana 2
Hex 3: Mana 0

The mana level for the dragon will be “mana level 1”.

- Hide
Hide is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2018, 07:56 PM   #8
Anthony
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
Default Re: Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

The standard interaction between a no mana zone and a spell is that the spell is suspended within the zone. I would extrapolate this to say that if a spell is partially in a zone, that portion of the spell that is in the zone gets suspended. If the spell is not something that can reasonably be split (e.g. a Wisdom spell), the GM should define a key location, usually either the vitals or the brain, and use the position of that key location.

For casting spells, I would typically set the key location to the brain; casters with No Brain should define an appropriate location.
__________________
My GURPS site and Blog.
Anthony is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2018, 09:09 PM   #9
Hide
 
Hide's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Default Re: Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony View Post
The standard interaction between a no mana zone and a spell is that the spell is suspended within the zone. I would extrapolate this to say that if a spell is partially in a zone, that portion of the spell that is in the zone gets suspended. If the spell is not something that can reasonably be split (e.g. a Wisdom spell), the GM should define a key location, usually either the vitals or the brain, and use the position of that key location.

For casting spells, I would typically set the key location to the brain; casters with No Brain should define an appropriate location.
But the source of mana is not you, it is the world, right? And as long as some part of your body is connected to a mana source, you can gather mana to fuel your powers. Thaumatology Magical Styles even features some kind of advantage to work under partial mana areas (not quite this situation, but still...). Regarding spells or items, well, think of a computer and itís power cord. It wonít shutdown unless the battery runs out or you cut its power supply. Also, how would you explain the fire-ball idea in B67?
Hide is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2018, 09:12 PM   #10
Plane
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Default Re: Different Mana Levels Simultaniously

Do any of the books have example of Mana Damper or Mana Enhancer in play? Or modified versions?
Plane is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.