Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-29-2016, 04:07 PM   #11
GodBeastX
 
GodBeastX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Behind You
Default Re: Advice on Spirit-based RPM variant

I love this so far. I am always interested in ideas to bring color to RPM =)
__________________
RPG Jutsu.com - Ninjas Play GURPS
GodBeastX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-29-2016, 06:51 PM   #12
Christopher R. Rice
 
Christopher R. Rice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Portsmouth, VA, USA
Default Re: Advice on Spirit-based RPM variant

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
Each geographical region in the campaign world has a list of spell descriptors. Spells matching those descriptors are the only spells that are possible to perform there. Characters may buy an advantage that exempts them from this rule for a specific type of spell. This is intended to make it so that casters will either have to search for locations where they can cast the spells they want to cast, influence conflicts so that they occur in the locations the casters need, or try to deal with having a limited set of effects they can produce. It should also make magic seem more finicky and less casual. This is the core of the idea. Everything else is optional add-ons.
Okay, now we're getting somewhere. For the rules for this I would do something like this: for a specific spell charge a perk; for a whole class of spells for a geographic region charge 5 points; for 10 points an entire group of spells the equivalent of 1/4 to 1/2 a Path; for 50 to 100 points you can cast spells anywhere (the latter may not be allowed at all depending on your GMing style).

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
Each combination of location and spell type that is possible there (called a spirit) would only allow spells of a certain power level or lower (measured in energy). This would make the process of finding somewhere to cast the spell more difficult for more powerful spells, potentially making it a full-on adventure for the most powerful. Note that this doesn't give a bonus to casting, merely acting as a requirement for more powerful spells.
This feels like a place of power to me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
Originally, I was thinking that each spirit would require you to use a different attribute as the base of your magic. This would encourage casters to focus on Magery and Path skills to improve their magic, rather than IQ, while still giving some incentive to have non-magical aptitudes. It was also intended to differentiate casters by having some of them work better with certain spirits than others and to allow/encourage casters with things like strength or health as core attributes as well as the typical IQ mages. You might be correct, however, that it is unnecessary complication and I should just make it base 10 magery.
It might work for RPM just because the Paths are so broad, but really, I think it would just be a nightmare in game and lead to some weird builds. At the least you could use calculated bases (DX + Magery Attribute / 2) or whatever may work. Again, might be too complicated.
__________________
My Twitter
My w23 Stuff
My Blog

Latest GURPS Book: Monster Hunters Power Ups 1
Latest TFT Book: Tomb of the Wizard-King

Become a Patron!
Christopher R. Rice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-31-2016, 04:21 AM   #13
Michael_Malus
 
Join Date: May 2011
Default Re: Advice on Spirit-based RPM variant

I've a homebrew system broadly along similar lines here, albiet untried, untested, and almost certainly unbalanced


Bound Spirits - GURPS RPM variant

Magic is cast by spirits bound to the mage. These spirits are limited and specific, with their own powers, power levels, and abilities.

Spirits are designed based (loosely) on the rules for Contacts at the Constantly Present frequency of appearance and no modifier for reliability. Extra Paths for a sprit are taken at a 50% discount, but must be equal to or less than their best Path skill.

Major limitation: Each spirit can only be involved in one casting at once - this includes conditional castings which have yet to trigger.

Spirits, like mages, have their own Mana reserve. This is based on their Magery being the minimum required for their best Path skill.

A spirit cannot (Or, possibly, will not) cast from a path at default, but multiple spirits (possibly even from different casters) can work together, binding all of them for the duration of the casting. While working together, the skills of all involved are limited to the lowest Path skill being used by any of the spirits, but otherwise function as in RPM.

Bound-spirit castings take no skill penalty from using three or more Paths.

Spirit castings can be made conditional without requiring them to have the Path of Magic - all spirits are assumed to have the Path of Magic equal to their highest Path skill for the purposes of making rituals conditional only. The energy costs for the effect still must be paid.

Casting

Commanding a spirit requires a Concentrate manouver by the mage. By default, the mage is assumed to be guiding the spirit and concentrating to help maintain its link to the physical world, making continious Concentrate manouvers each turn. If he chooses to act instead, subtract -2 from all rolls to do with the spell, but he is free to act separately, even commanding other spirits in separate castings.

Ritual Adept

All spirit castings automatically count as benefiting from Ritual Adept (Space) and both levels of Ritual Adept (Time), while Ritual Adept (Connection) is unavailable.

Trappings & Mandatory and Significant Modifiers

These are dependent on the tradition of the spirit, not the caster. This also applies to what specialities of Symbol Drawing and similar skills would apply, and possibly to which places would count a a Place of Power.

In general, the bonuses from these should be quite small without proper preparation, perhaps limited to just negating penalties, while larger bonuses require the casting to take the full duration under Non-Adepts And Magic.

Spirit Cost Table

Code:
Best Path Level    Mana Reserve  Cost        Extra Path cost
12                 0             4           +2
15                 9             8           +4
18                 18            12          +6
21                 27            16          +8
A few example spirits:

Robert: A mages familiar, highly skilled at warding, scrying, and dealings with free spirits
Path of Magic-18, Path of Mind-15, Path of Spirit-15; Mana Reserve 18. 20 points.

Watcher: Commonly used as messengers or guards, these minor spirits have little personality of their own
Path of Magic-12, Path of Mind-12; Mana Reserve 0. 6 points.

Traeth Taranau: A minor spirit of storms, his service traded to a magician in a deal with a more powerful spirit.
Path of Energy-18, Path of Matter-15, Mana Reserve 18. 16 points.
Michael_Malus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-2019, 09:55 PM   #14
Kax
 
Kax's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: God's Own Country
Default Re: Advice on Spirit-based RPM variant

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
Alright, so I feel incredibly inarticulate right now. Rereading my first post, I can see why. It wasn't very clearly written and jumbled a bunch of different ideas together. So, the core idea, stripped of fluff as much as possible (the rules are in bold, while the explanation is not):
[*]Each geographical region in the campaign world has a list of spell descriptors. Spells matching those descriptors are the only spells that are possible to perform there. Characters may buy an advantage that exempts them from this rule for a specific type of spell. This is intended to make it so that casters will either have to search for locations where they can cast the spells they want to cast, influence conflicts so that they occur in the locations the casters need, or try to deal with having a limited set of effects they can produce. It should also make magic seem more finicky and less casual. This is the core of the idea. Everything else is optional add-ons.

So if I want to use a particular spell wherever I like I have to go where pokemon with that spell exist and capture/make friends with one 'cos trainers don't have their own spells beyond being able to call and bind/cajole pokemon.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
[*]Each combination of location and spell type that is possible there (called a spirit) would only allow spells of a certain power level or lower (measured in energy). This would make the process of finding somewhere to cast the spell more difficult for more powerful spells, potentially making it a full-on adventure for the most powerful. Note that this doesn't give a bonus to casting, merely acting as a requirement for more powerful spells.

And pokemon have their own individual power, which may be changeable by training/evolving the pokemon. But if I want a serious boost in power I've got to go get a more powerful pokemon.


Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
[*]Originally, I was thinking that each spirit would require you to use a different attribute as the base of your magic. This would encourage casters to focus on Magery and Path skills to improve their magic, rather than IQ, while still giving some incentive to have non-magical aptitudes. It was also intended to differentiate casters by having some of them work better with certain spirits than others and to allow/encourage casters with things like strength or health as core attributes as well as the typical IQ mages. You might be correct, however, that it is unnecessary complication and I should just make it base 10 magery.[/LIST]

Each pokemon has its own correspondences, including possibly (if you want to go there) different correspondences with the trainer's abilities.


A bit of added humour, but this looks like what you're saying.
__________________
Paul May | MIB 1138 (on hiatus)

Last edited by Kax; 03-07-2019 at 09:59 PM.
Kax is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-2019, 10:37 PM   #15
dataweaver
 
dataweaver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: the frozen wastelands of Southern California
Default Re: Advice on Spirit-based RPM variant

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
I've been musing about a heavy modification of RPM and wanted to get some feedback on my ideas.

The fluff: Spells are actually cast by powerful spirits. Every location will have a collection of spirits that are present and some casters carry their own spirits with them. Casters preform elaborate rituals to gain the notice of spirits and gain their assisitance.
So far, so good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
The mechanics:

It uses Effect Shaping with Ritual Adept prohibited.
Note that with Effect Shaping, there are no energy costs associated with casting; it's all handled by skill penalties.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
The world is covered in overlapping domains of spirits. Almost everywhere will have one or more powerful spirits. Each spirit has the following set of characteristics:

A descriptor for spells used with them. This might be something like “Fire” or “Memory”. Spells must use a spirit that thematically fits with the spell (GM's call). Particularly complex spells may require multiple types of spirits, in which case finding a place where both classes of spirits are present can be an adventure in itself.
…so kind of like aspected Mana Zones, or different levels of Sanctity for different deities. Are these domains formalized boundaries (like territory maps), or are they basically a quantification of what sorts of spirits happen to be nearby?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
A maximum energy that they can handle. This will typically be quite high, so that the caster's skill will be what limits their power, but extremely powerful spells will require powerful spirits.
…and this is where the “Effect Shaping doesn't have energy costs” rears its head.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dfinlay View Post
An attribute that combines with Magery to determine your Path skills. Some spirits must be reasoned with (IQ), some must be tracked down (Per), some must be mentally resisted/overcome (Will), some must be impressed with physical feats (HT/ST/DX). Some may also allow you to use certain advantages (Appearance/Charisma, for example). This applies even if the spirits already want to help you. It's just part of how spiritual magic functions.

A tradition (set of significant or mandatory modifiers) that works for spells with the spirit. Some may have more than one.

Some spirits may grant a bonus (used instead of places of power).
Have you considered having the places of power represent the “population density”, as it were, of a particular kind of spirit, instead of making it something that represents a particular kind of spirit? For instance, in a place that's crawling with fire spirits, fire-aspected RPM gets a sizeable bonus; if fire spirits are scarce, you suffer s penalty; and if they're completely absent, your fire castings fail outright.

I have some further thoughts, but let's start with these ones.
__________________
Point balance is a myth.[1][2][3][4]
dataweaver is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
effect shaping, homebrew, ritual path magic, spirit magic, spirits

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.