10-31-2012, 06:39 PM | #31 |
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Ottawa, Canada
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
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10-31-2012, 11:14 PM | #32 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
Quote:
Best defense against most of this is going to be the berserkers reach keeping grappling/pinning foes out of CC.
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11-01-2012, 01:39 AM | #33 |
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: The Fine Line Between Black and White
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
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11-01-2012, 01:53 AM | #34 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
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11-01-2012, 02:34 AM | #35 |
Untagged
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
It should be a percentage not a flat point per point basis. Not everyone plays with human ranges exclusively.
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11-01-2012, 04:23 AM | #36 | |
Join Date: Feb 2012
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
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But what of a telegraphic attack (AoA or not) to hand? A good warrior would be able to dismember even a minotaur hand. Yet I don't know if DF contains D&D style spells to regrowth dismembered body part, turning this menace in a minor annoyance. I never considered Berserker disadvantage as a sensed option for a PC, because I always figured it as a quick death condamne. Now, reading this thread, it seems a huge advantage more than a disadvantage. I'm confused. |
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11-01-2012, 08:46 AM | #37 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Tuscaloosa, AL
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
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11-08-2012, 08:50 AM | #38 |
Fightin' Round the World
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: New Jersey
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
As for pins not being resistible if you All-Out Attack: I think that doesn't reality check well, but it didn't come up in the playtest.
I think it's perfectly reasonable to say that the Regular Contest for a pin is, in fact, an effect roll (much like injury, or the quick contest for strangulation and neck snap), not a defense-like roll. Had this come up during the playtest, I'm sure we would have changed the wording to make it so. So IMO (remember I'm a freelancer and co-author, not an SJG employee) you could amend the rule to takeout "pins" from the sentence about automatically losing a contest, and revise the line below to say "You get a ST roll to resist a pin, or a ST or HT roll to resist injury from strangling, Arm Lock, Neck Snap, Wrench Limb, etc." I personally wouldn't apply the -2 to the contest for a Committed Attack, either, but if you like that, -2 for a CA, -4 for an AOA would parallel nicely, I think. Reality checking would support this, I think - it's easy to take someone down if they aren't trying to stop you, but it's not easier to pin someone who is furiously fighting with no thought to defense. That would make it reasonable to do that multi-man rush against a crazed person in order to get them down - suddenly, you need all of them. It should be harder to hold down a berserker, even if it's easier to get them down. Plus this would match Sweep, where you still get your normal rolls, you just don't get much chance to stop the attacker from trying. Doug can discuss what Technical Grappling does, since I know he's said it handles "pin" in an entirely different fashion than BASIC SET or MARTIAL ARTS.
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11-08-2012, 10:46 AM | #39 |
GURPS Line Editor
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Montréal, Québec
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
As Peter's coauthor on Martial Arts (and an official staff member, too!), I endorse his words. The spirit of the rule was to prevent people from doing All-Out Attacks against grapplers knowing that they could still evade the many grappling moves that rely on the Quick Contest mechanism instead of the attack roll-defense roll mechanic for their roll to "hit." The exception to allow ST and HT rolls was meant to cover all "saving throws" against all bad effects from grappling moves that had already "hit" by either mechanism . . . and where we called out injury from locks, we probably ought to have explicitly allowed all rolls to resist control (forced change of position, pin, etc.), injury, or affliction (choking or whatever). In short, read that as: "You can't use DX in Quick Contests vs. grappling moves."
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11-08-2012, 05:48 PM | #40 | |
Doctor of GURPS Ballistics
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Lakeville, MN
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Re: Dungeon Fantasy party compositions
Quote:
Instead, you attack to both grapple and break free, and both use an effect roll to see how good your grapple is. To pin someone, you rack up so much effect that they can't roll (their effective skill is less than 3) to do anything. TG still retains rolls vs. HT or ST (sometimes penalized) in cases where you're resisting injury or where ST is a stand in for mass. That's the short version; obviously the new rules are a wee bit more detailed.
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