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Old 02-02-2014, 05:59 PM   #41
Figleaf23
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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Originally Posted by Agemegos View Post
Social cues in exotic societies often seem that way to outsiders. There are some in which you need a pretty fair knowledge of the brands of jeans and shoes to tell the somebodies from the nobodies.
Indeed. And settings rich in that sort of thing can be great to read about, but they can also be difficult to game in, since players have neither the proper upbringing, nor script support.

Maybe there's a fine line where elaboration is no longer useful.
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Old 02-02-2014, 06:06 PM   #42
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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Originally Posted by Figleaf23 View Post
Indeed. And settings rich in that sort of thing can be great to read about, but they can also be difficult to game in, since players have neither the proper upbringing, nor script support..
Yeah, it's handy to be able to make a Savoir Faire roll and be told that an NPC is Status 4.
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Old 02-06-2014, 08:24 PM   #43
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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Originally Posted by Agemegos View Post
But you can't have a group of Contacts throughout a generic social stratum of anything larger than a town. The upper class of an interstellar empire is right out.
RAW Gurps doesn't seem to agree with this position:

Social Engineering pg 52
Contact Group: One standard way of defining a Contact
Group (p. B44) is as a network of informants throughout an
organization. Ordinarily such a network serves someone outside
the organization, but that’s not mandatory; e.g., an experienced
police officer might have Contacts all through the
department to go to for favors.


Social Engineering pg 59
A high-Status individual may approach others as if they
were members of a Contact Group (pp. B44-45). This isn’t
limited to information; it includes things like gaining admission
or good seating at a club or event, or having the policeor courts overlook a minor offense. The GM should determine
the effective skill level of each one-time “Contact,” and
consult the chart below.
Status Effective Skill
1-2 12
3-4 15
5-6 18
7-8 21
If the “Contact’s” effective skill is equal to or less than the
value shown for the asker’s Status, treat him as Usually
Reliable. For each step by which his effective skill exceeds this,
drop his reliability one step: to Somewhat Reliable, then
Unreliable, and then to completely unapproachable.
Example: A Status 3 doctor could ask a beat cop (effective
skill 12) or detective (effective skill 15) for small favors, as
though either were a Usually Reliable Contact. If she had to ask
for information from the Chief of Police (effective skill 18), he
would act as Somewhat Reliable, while the City Commissioner
(effective skill 21) would be Unreliable.
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Old 02-07-2014, 01:38 AM   #44
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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Originally Posted by isf View Post
RAW Gurps doesn't seem to agree with this position:

Social Engineering pg 52
Contact Group: One standard way of defining a Contact
Group (p. B44) is as a network of informants throughout an
organization. Ordinarily such a network serves someone outside
the organization, but that’s not mandatory; e.g., an experienced
police officer might have Contacts all through the
department to go to for favors.
It's an either/or thing. Either you get an organisation, or you get a social stratum etc. of a particular town. Check B.44

Quote:
Social Engineering pg 59
A high-Status individual may approach others as if they
were members of a Contact Group (pp. B44-45). This isn’t
limited to information; it includes things like gaining admission
or good seating at a club or event, or having the policeor courts overlook a minor offense. The GM should determine
the effective skill level of each one-time “Contact,” and
consult the chart below.
Status Effective Skill
1-2 12
3-4 15
5-6 18
7-8 21
If the “Contact’s” effective skill is equal to or less than the
value shown for the asker’s Status, treat him as Usually
Reliable. For each step by which his effective skill exceeds this,
drop his reliability one step: to Somewhat Reliable, then
Unreliable, and then to completely unapproachable.
Example: A Status 3 doctor could ask a beat cop (effective
skill 12) or detective (effective skill 15) for small favors, as
though either were a Usually Reliable Contact. If she had to ask
for information from the Chief of Police (effective skill 18), he
would act as Somewhat Reliable, while the City Commissioner
(effective skill 21) would be Unreliable.
That's Status, not Contact Group.
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Old 02-12-2014, 07:35 PM   #45
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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Originally Posted by Agemegos View Post
It's an either/or thing. Either you get an organisation, or you get a social stratum etc. of a particular town. Check B.44

Yes, but I thought that was how you could represent her ability to get extra benefits from being one of those “Eichberger, yes, that's right, Eichberger”. I'd build it as a reputation and/or contact groups for the trust and service.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Agemegos View Post
That's Status, not Contact Group.
I thought that you were looking for a way to have an interstellar social stratum as a contact group which this would be an raw way to work that ability.
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Old 02-12-2014, 10:41 PM   #46
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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Yes, but I thought that was how you could represent her ability to get extra benefits from being one of those “Eichberger, yes, that's right, Eichberger”. I'd build it as a reputation and/or contact groups for the trust and service.
I'll give that some consideration. I'd like Status to handle that in sensible gradations down from the Eichbergers and Imperial Councillors through the Aths and Vomacts and field officers to people with no grandparents worth mentioning working as stewards on passenger liners. But perhaps what you suggest will turn out to be the better build.

Quote:
I thought that you were looking for a way to have an interstellar social stratum as a contact group which this would be an raw way to work that ability.
Sorry, I thought you were putting that forward as evidence to support an argument that RAW allows a Contact Group to pervade a whole stratum of interstellar society. My mistake.
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Old 02-12-2014, 10:49 PM   #47
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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Status -1: performing artists, free-lance providers of personal services, free-lance content providers, and merchants vending comforts and luxuries

Status 0: those with a personal reputation for furthering the Mission on their own initiative; authors of Empire-affirming journalism and fiction; routine functions in the bits of the Eichberger Trust that earn the money to keep the whole thing going and jobs in the Home Office that keeps IDJ habitable; ...

Status 1: Colonial Office assistance departments or enlisted ranks of the Navy

Status 2: People whose families have a long history of naval service; specific officeholders tbd

Status 3: those whose family tradition of naval service goes back to the space navy of the Republic of Mayflower; higher officeholders tbd

Status 4: imperial family without portfolios

Status 5: imperial family with portfolios higher than status 4.

You could stop there for SS, and have higher ups represented by Ranks beyond that. Or you can elaborate higher gradations for active imperials plus any exceptional individuals they bring in as viziers or whatever.
That looks about right.
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Old 02-13-2014, 06:59 AM   #48
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

After I wrote that, I got to wondering whether what you really need is a levelized group of Social Regard traits instead of Status. I'm not sure there's enough raw power associated with high status in this setting to make it Status -- but that's for you to determine, of course.
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Old 02-13-2014, 02:42 PM   #49
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

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After I wrote that, I got to wondering whether what you really need is a levelized group of Social Regard traits instead of Status. I'm not sure there's enough raw power associated with high status in this setting to make it Status -- but that's for you to determine, of course.
Mechanically there are two big differences between Status and Social Regard. The first is cost-of-living, about which the less said the better. The other is that Status at least immunises you against other people's Status, and often makes you contemptuous and disdainful. At a social function for people with Social Regard everyone reacts to everyone else at a positive, and people with Social Regard react to ordinary people normally. At a social function for the upper crust all the guests react to one another normally–they don't get along as well as the people with Social Regard. And they tend react to ordinary people at a negative.
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Old 02-14-2014, 07:51 AM   #50
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Default Re: Flat Black: Status in the Imperial Service

So, by inference, those ARE the features you mean to have apply to society in the setting?
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