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Old 07-19-2021, 01:15 PM   #721
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Default Re: Exotic Governmental/Legal Systems

Nr. 4 is the way Malaysia handles it.
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Old 07-20-2021, 02:43 PM   #722
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Originally Posted by Johnny1A.2 View Post
Imagine a tight federation like the USA, which we'll use as an example. Imagine if, instead of being either directly elected or chosen by the Electoral College, the U.S. President was one of the State Governors, who are elected conventionally in their States. This official continues as Governor, he is simultaneously U.S. President and Governor of State of X.
The key problem with this is the one it shares with all schemes in which one person holds multiple offices - either one or both offices need to be substantially less than full time, or one of them gets shorted. It works fine for a ceremonial presidency, but for something like the US where governors and presidents are working executives who are already so overloaded they have to entrust decisions they probably should be involved in to their staffs already, it's probably not a great idea.
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Old 07-20-2021, 02:58 PM   #723
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We could try rotating which polity supplies the governor. Though that could make for some interestingly cyclical politics.


Some nations have been formed of a union between various states, but a single large and important one dominates its politics: you could use that for the single governor model. Examples include England, Holland, and Bohemia.


That can start looking like an empire situation though, with the core polity controlling the others.
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Old 07-21-2021, 04:39 AM   #724
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Governor whose state did best by some criteria becomes President for the next term. So they don't hold both offices at the same time but you usually know a year or so ahead of time who will be the next President.
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Old 08-01-2021, 09:05 AM   #725
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I haven't read through the whole backlog, but here's some:

This Pleothcracy has limited local taxes, but each vote costs a fixed $10. Votes for any and all races are tabulated by the total amount of cash raised. There is no limit to the number of votes cast, nor by whom, making this place profoundly ruled by the rich, a fact accepted as the nature of society by its citizens.

In contrast, a Drachmacracy grants each citizen a vote token in each election; vote tokens are fully transferable, and usually sold or offered to someone who takes it to a third or even fourth or fifth party. This can be done commercially, but it's also frequently performed by grassroots campaigns. On or before the election itself, the tokenholders fill out a given ballot once, with the weight of that ballot multiplied by the number of tokens cashed. A token's value changes in every election, but often can be sold for $50. Of note is that far more of the government's work is performed through popular elections, with tokenholders essentially being very temporary legislators.

A strange kind of federated nation exists wherin the federal level controls the military, foreign policy, and a few other important elements, but all internal affairs are controlled by one of any number of internal substates. The substates are made up of individual counties and districts, and these subunits may change the substate they subscribe to with a simple popular vote. Urban regions generally fall into one of six wealthy substates, while rural regions are united behind 32 reactionary regional substates.

There is a complicated Instant Runoff Approval Democracy wherin voters place their favored candidates in order of approval in one box, and their disliked candidates in order of disapproval in another. The most net-disliked candidates are removed and votes recalculated one by one until the most-liked candidate is selected. Election is performed over the course of a month, with a small tax credit applied for citizens who vote within the first two weeks.

Finally, a Centocracy. Each voter is given 100 votes for each ballot. The ballot may contain no more than 20 entries (an additional 100 votes are given for each further page, exclusively). Voters may place their votes in any combination or order. For instance, they could vote for one candidate 100 times and ignore the rest of the ballot, or scatter the votes in different amounts for everything on the page.

Bonus: A Septarchy wherin seven executives lead the country equally; they are equal co-rulers, and in the case of conflict simple majority rules. Each one serves for 14 years, with an election held every other year. Each Septarch has a small train of secretaries who step forward to fill the Septarch's duties in the case of death or disability, and in ordinary conditions file executive actions in their specific fields (Foreign Affairs, Executive Defense, Justice, Services, Intelligence, and a few other divisions). Also worth noting is that there is not one military branch, but three; the legislature (a complicated parliamentary thing) has a fully separate Legislative Defense Force, as does the Judicial force. Civil wars are considered unfortunate but a necessary part of maintaining the separation of powers.

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Old 08-08-2021, 02:54 PM   #726
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Originally Posted by ericthered View Post
We could try rotating which polity supplies the governor. Though that could make for some interestingly cyclical politics.


Some nations have been formed of a union between various states, but a single large and important one dominates its politics: you could use that for the single governor model. Examples include England, Holland, and Bohemia.


That can start looking like an empire situation though, with the core polity controlling the others.
That can be offset to some extent by assigning certain jobs to certain member-states. For ex, imagine what UK politics would look like if the PM had to be English, but the Chancellor had to be Welsh and the Home Secretary and the Foreign Secretary had to be Scots. The PM/Monarch could still appoint those offices, but only to nationals of particular states.
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Old 08-08-2021, 06:13 PM   #727
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Default Re: Exotic Governmental/Legal Systems

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For ex, imagine what UK politics would look like if the PM had to be English, but the Chancellor had to be Welsh and the Home Secretary and the Foreign Secretary had to be Scots. The PM/Monarch could still appoint those offices, but only to nationals of particular states.
First off, how would that handle people that have say one English parent and one Scottish?

Also, do any official documents in the UK differentiate between "nationalities" of the UK. IOW, does a person born in say, Leeds, have papers that say that they're English?
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Old 08-09-2021, 12:46 AM   #728
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First off, how would that handle people that have say one English parent and one Scottish?

Also, do any official documents in the UK differentiate between "nationalities" of the UK. IOW, does a person born in say, Leeds, have papers that say that they're English?
No, they don't. You're British, not English (at least for the time being.

That's because it's the United Kingdom...etc. etc.

I'm Australian by birth. My mum was multi generational Australian and my Dad is Scottish (though he long ago also acquired Australian citizenship).

Under UK law, I am a British Citizen by descent - because of my Dad. So he was born in Scotland, but British citizenship and that's what I also have.

Now, if Scotland were to leave the UK it's possible I might qualify for Scottish citizenship, whilst likely retaining British. I would probably also end up (again) with European Union citizenship as Scotland would almost certainly look to rejoin the EU.

And, all of that would be legal in Australia and I would keep my Australian citizenship so long as I didn't have to apply for those citizenships and they were just a matter of course because of descent or other reasons.

All gets complex, no? :-)
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Old 08-09-2021, 07:13 AM   #729
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First off, how would that handle people that have say one English parent and one Scottish?
Are you saying you'd have difficulty determining who is and is not a True Scotsman?

More seriously, I could see this as being something with various weighting factors, regarding parentage, place of birth, and where you were during various stages of life (up to and including where you went to college and where you were later employed). You've got to pass a certain threshold to qualify, and may also be disqualified if you get a higher "score" for some other state (perhaps you want to be Home Secretary, and scored high enough as a Scotsman to do so, but your score as an Englishman was higher - this might mean you aren't eligible to be Home Secretary but can be Prime Minister, or it might mean you actually qualify for both positions; or maybe your Englishman score isn't high enough for PM, so you can't hold either position - you're too English to be a True Scotsman, but not English enough to be PM). Alternatively, you could have formal citizenship for a specific member-state, which automatically confers citizenship to the nation as a whole. You may need to be a "natural-born citizen" of a given state to qualify for any positions that are specific to said state, or maybe the requirement is simply to have been a citizen of said state for a certain number of years (much as you need to reside in a given state in the USA for a set number of years before you can be appointed to Congress on that state's behalf).
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Old 08-09-2021, 08:35 AM   #730
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More seriously, I could see this as being something with various weighting factors, regarding parentage, place of birth, and where you were during various stages of life (up to and including where you went to college and where you were later employed).
This happens for membership in some real-world groups. I grew up near a Native American reservation that's grown more aggressive about its membership requirements throughout my life. When my aunt married a 50% blooded member, she became a member through marriage. But they've since upped the requirements: You need to be 50% or more to be a full member of the tribe, and if you marry outside the tribe you're out. Previous members like my aunt (who is comically pale and blonde to be involved in all of this) were grandfathered in, but if she marries again, even to a full blooded member (and one proposed) she looses her tribal membership, which has significant financial benefits.

So yeah, this sort of thing gets messy quickly.
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