01-23-2020, 04:49 PM | #1 |
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Tank vs. Cannon
Bit of a sanity check - is it reasonable for a low grade, early WW2 tank (say, a Japanese I-Go) to be successfully killed by a Napoleonic style cannon, possibly scared up by some Chinese soldiers?
Hi-tech gives the Bourges Mle 1853 12lber (presumably a pretty typical Napoleonic style field gun) a damage of 6dx5 (mean 105) and the FT-17 45/20 dr (and given that the FT-17 has, according to Wikipedia 8-22mm of armour against the I-Go's 6-17mm that should be representative) … which makes it look doable, but is it sane? |
01-23-2020, 05:11 PM | #2 | |
Join Date: Jun 2006
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
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01-23-2020, 05:22 PM | #3 |
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Bristol
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
Armour vs, IIRC, subsonic projectiles get at least twice the DR (not sure if it is 10x armour).
Not forgetting that gun laying a 12lber is going to take ages, and there is a maximum firing 13/14 skill. Therefore, after deducting distance, speed and adding size the net result is going to be miserable. |
01-23-2020, 05:25 PM | #4 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
22mm of WWII armor steel should be around DR 60 (penetration is normalized for RHA being DR 70/inch, and I would expect early tanks to be comparable to RHA).
Not sure about the penetration of the 12 lb gun, though. You can essentially view it as a 144 weight (5.24*scale) 12 gauge shotgun (12 gauge means a spherical lead ball would be 1/12 lb, 12 lb means a spherical lead ball would be 12 lb), and 12 gauge slugs are generally stopped by level IIIa armor (DR 12), so I'd be tempted to assign a (0.5) armor divisor. |
01-23-2020, 05:39 PM | #5 | |
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
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That said it would be a really impressive shot. Napoleonic-style cannons aren't very well suited to tracking a moving target. And are going to be trickier to conceal that a modern AT gun too. You probably need to lure the tank into a really narrow ambush spot so that you can aim the gun long before it arrives and just touch it off at the right time.
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01-23-2020, 05:56 PM | #6 |
Join Date: Feb 2011
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
That's what I was thinking. Considering the disparity, you might be able to get away with tricking them into overconfidence.
If you're going to ambush them, it might be a better use of your black powder to make mines and hide them under the roadway, so you're sure to get a track hit. But then, maybe you don't have the time to do that, but you do have the cannon. |
01-23-2020, 06:21 PM | #7 |
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
The I-go might even have riveted armor. Put a 12-lb cast iron (not lead) cannonball in the middle of one of the frontal plates and said plate will probably radically deform and the rivets would pop loose explosively. A serious danger to the crew.
You might or might not get a neat circular hole in the armor but that armor was not but to handle that cannonball.
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Fred Brackin |
01-23-2020, 10:31 PM | #8 | |
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southeast NC
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
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The Renault FT was pretty much only intended to be proof against rifle and machine gun fire. A direct hit from artillery was considered unlikely, and impossible to protect against while keeping the desired performance. Of course, once tanks hit the field, someone starts working on heavier rifles and more responsive direct fire artillery.
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01-23-2020, 11:23 PM | #9 | |
Join Date: Jul 2008
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
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I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident. |
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01-24-2020, 01:48 AM | #10 | |
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Central Europe
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Re: Tank vs. Cannon
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Edit: sectional density: 5400 grams to 10 grams is 540:1, 120 mm calibre to 8 mm calibre is 15:1, 540 / (15 * 15) = 2.4, so the cannonball has twice the sectional density of the bullet. The physics of a 120 mm projectile hitting a 20 mm plate are different than the physics of a 8 mm projectile hitting a 20 mm plate, and the physics of a soft lead bullet and a cast-iron one are different, but the tankette is not going to like that at all.
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"It is easier to banish a habit of thought than a piece of knowledge." H. Beam Piper This forum got less aggravating when I started using the ignore feature Last edited by Polydamas; 01-24-2020 at 02:23 AM. |
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cannon, tank |
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