HT: UK armed police G36c loadout?

[Azinctus]

UK armed police now use the G36c. What kind of sight do they have on the optics rail? Here is a link to a picture.

What kind of ammunition do you think they have? In the photo the clip is only half full, would that be 15 rounds out of a possible 30+1? Do you imagine they carry many spare clips on their person or in the car?

Is this weapon complicated to use? If an untrained shooter or a farmer used to a hunting rifle got their hands on it what would be reasonable familiarity penalties and how many rounds fired in combat or training would be enough to get rid of those penalties? If in the next zombie holocaust I get my hands on one with just 15 rounds in it do I have time to learn before the bullets are gone?

[RyanW]

Looks like a reflex sight.

As far as difficulty, anyone who has handled any assault rifle should find this no more or less difficult than any other. Most civilian shooters would probably be unfamiliar with fully automatic fire, but a little bit of practice should get them used to it (though a recreational shooter will still do poorly the first time they shoot at a person).

[Sam Cade]

Originally Posted by Azinctus

In the photo the clip is only half full, would that be 15 rounds out of a possible 30+1?

The magazine is full. The lower half contains the compressed spring and follower.

Originally Posted by Azinctus

What kind of sight do they have on the optics rail?

It's an Eotech 512. It takes AA batteries.

Originally Posted by Azinctus

Is this weapon complicated to use?

Nope. Insert magazine. Pull back then release bolt. Move fire selector/safety to desired position.
Pull trigger...or not.

Provided that you aren't starting at zero, basic operation of any modern firearm should take all of about 5-10 minutes to learn.

[HANS]

The sight is an EOTech512 or 552 battery-powered reflex sight. Most special ops units use the 552, which has a setting for use with night vision goggles. These chaps probably use the 512, since it's cheaper.

The magazine is not HALF full, but it is also not completely filled -- you can tell from the space above the lower lug. I'm guessing 20 rounds. It is SOP for many British police agencies to only patrol with less than 30 rounds -- either by using 15-round magazines (in case of the MP5SFA2 and MP5SFA3) or by underloading their magazines. The sane reason for this eludes me -- if you're trusting your specially-trained authorised firearms officers (which all British police with a gun are) with a weapon, it's unclear to me why you wouldn't trust them with 30 rather than 15 or 20 rounds . . . Anyway, it's almost certain that the chap does not carry a reload for the carbine.

Finally, this is not a G36C, but a G36CSF (RoF 3). By law, British police are NOT authorised to use full-automatic weapons.

As to use, if you're familiar with another rifle, they are easy to use.

Cheers

HANS

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by HANS

The magazine is not HALF full, but it is also not completely filled -- you can tell from the space above the lower lug. I'm guessing 20 rounds. It is SOP for many British police agencies to only patrol with less than 30 rounds -- either by using 15-round magazines (in case of the MP5SFA2 and MP5SFA3) or by underloading their magazines. The sane reason for this eludes me -- if you're trusting your specially-trained authorised firearms officers (which all British police with a gun are) with a weapon, it's unclear to me why you wouldn't trust them with 30 rather than 15 or 20 rounds . . . Anyway, it's almost certain that the chap does not carry a reload for the carbine.

Might it have to do with preventing stoppages, per Underloaded Magazines (Tactical Shooting pg 20)? My impression of the G36 line of rifles is that they're high quality and quite reliable, but I could also understand if there's a slightly increased chance of malfunction (probably below GURPS resolution) when using topped-up magazines.

[HANS]

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

Might it have to do with preventing stoppages, per Underloaded Magazines (Tactical Shooting pg 20)?

No, definitely not.

Originally Posted by vierasmarius

My impression of the G36 line of rifles is that they're high quality and quite reliable, but I could also understand if there's a slightly increased chance of malfunction (probably below GURPS resolution) when using topped-up magazines.

No. I've never heard that in context with this weapon system. Also, IF you underload your magazines, you underload from 30 to 28 or 29 -- not 15 or 20.

Cheers

HANS

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by HANS

No. I've never heard that in context with this weapon system. Also, IF you underload your magazines, you underload from 30 to 28 or 29 -- not 15 or 20.

Ah, I see. So the reason is more likely bureaucratic rather than technical.

[Azinctus]

Thanks for the help guys.

Originally Posted by Sam Cade

The magazine is full. The lower half contains the compressed spring and follower.

Sorry, magazine.

Originally Posted by HANS

Finally, this is not a G36C, but a G36CSF (RoF 3). By law, British police are NOT authorised to use full-automatic weapons.

Good catch.

Semi-automatic weapons with under filled magazines still doesn't make you any less dead if you get mistaken for a terrorist or a drug dealer. But it might be less useful in a zombie holocaust.

[Crakkerjakk]

Originally Posted by HANS

The sane reason for this eludes me -- if you're trusting your specially-trained authorised firearms officers (which all British police with a gun are) with a weapon, it's unclear to me why you wouldn't trust them with 30 rather than 15 or 20 rounds . . . Anyway, it's almost certain that the chap does not carry a reload for the carbine.

True story, when I first arrived in Kuwait we were given 60 rounds for "perimeter defense" purposes, and told we would be issued our full combat load once we got to our forward positions near the Iraq-Kuwait border.

When we get there, they say we can draw our other 120 rounds Monday, four days or so away. Sunday night some poor schmuch goes into a port-a-john and eats his rifle. Come Monday they refuse to issue us any more rounds. Because apparently it takes 61 rounds to shoot yourself in the head.

Oh, and they were still willing to issue us two frags apiece. That last bit our own command decided wasn't a great idea.