Mailanka's Musings -- GURPS Content Post

[Kalzazz]

I really like how you dropped most of the disads off and how you added more variety of troopers. That is cool.

I think you got the unarmed / rifle butt damages somewhat awry due to copy pasting, especially on the recon guy, but I would check over those

[Kalzazz]

You note on the catgirl I made I gave her Night Vision when I did it freehand!

I'm not sure whether you can Shield Rush with a Force Buckler, I mean, bucklers are specifically forbidden from making Shield Rushs (pg 408 of Campaigns)

And he is still parrying after a move and attack, which we discussed on first playtest

Hmmm, actually! If we use the optional rule on pg 107 of Martial Arts, he CAN parry, he just can't block! Since he hit with his shield arm. Thats a cool optional rule

I'm not sure about parrying missed attacks . . . his parry is now much lower though since he has already parried twice

Blowing up the grenade was fun, and she could have just as easily have killed him outrigbt so why not

Leylana killing the guy was funny, and I could totally see it happening in a movie, but I have utterly no idea how I would DM such, I mean, how does she hit him in the face when she is behind him? I have no idea! I probably would have randomly added an extra -2 or something, since skull is -7 from front, -5 from behind, so face is -5 from front, should be -7 from behind? Anyway, I am fairly sure Tactical Shooting allows Telegraphic Attacks at 'can actually touch' range, which is good for surprise attacks from behind . . . but again, here we are attacking from behind at a front hit location? Weird

Where is the rule bucklers can only block once? I can remember 'shields can only block once' and from Martial Arts, 'shields iterate at -5', but I can't remember a buckler distinction.

Dun also would really love to get Weapon Master damage bonuses sometime, that would result in happiness, joy, and Star Wars style chopping even the cooler shinier types of battle droids in half in a single blow!

I liked the shield, it was cool. House rule territory, but for my Primus Republic Campaign setting (Pseudo Fantasy 'I Can't Believe its Not Rome, if Rome had Airships and Guns and Things, Okay Yeah, it is Easy to Believe its Not Rome Now, but theres togas and recipes from Apicius and Mars and Minerva and such so there we go') which I've run a few campaigns in of different types one of the Things of Awesome was I wanted folks to be able to block gunfire with scutums (because scutums are Things of Awesome for Faux Fantasy Rome), so I allowed it with a perk. I also allowed 'Super Ranged Deceptive Attack' which DID work vs shields with a perk to. So epic shieldmen could stand tall against gunfire, and epic bowmen/gunmen could also drop shieldmen etc

The Primus Republic also involved the first use of Manasabres (technically they should have been Manaspathas or something, but Manasabre is pretty much the term we use for magical 'I can't believe its not a lightsabre') (based off Kuroshima's writeup in this thread http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=123386 ), and they worked fine! I allowed them to be instantly useful on a fast draw so you could have Manasabre Iajutsu

Here is a thread where you can see some discussion on blocking gunfire I started http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=90737

There is actually a Precognitive Block skill and a Force Sword / Force Buckler sword and board style in Pyramid 09 - Space Opera


I liked that you rolled dodge, even though here it didn't actually make a difference . . . but it does establish the precedent that maybe in the future some dodges might happen and maybe deceptive attack wouldn't be a bad goal in the future


What is the point of them having armor if not to force people to shoot at weak points (or use hefty weapons suitable for hitting like a space going truck)? They die on one point of damage, so . . . if sidearms can knock through their armor easily they could just wear tshirts. Modern US military armor can stop a standard rifle shot cold if the shot hits the armor, and much non military armor can stop sidearms. I did notice that against the heavier weapons the armor wasn't so effective

Since this is Psi Wars, and we expect Psi to be a thing, an amusing note that does in some cases justify heavy armor / weak weapons. When I was playing X-Com, the final mission (this being the old DOS X-Com) has you up against a slew of mind controlling enemies. So my eventual solution after seeing my own guys massacre there buddies constantly was to A - put everyone in power armor, and B - Give everyone laser pistols. Now my guys weren't able to kill each other, and could still (though needing much more shots than with the heavier weapons) kill the enemies. The enemies who were busy mind controlling my guys and having them harmlessly zap each other

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

You note on the catgirl I made I gave her Night Vision when I did it freehand!

Heh.

I'm not sure whether you can Shield Rush with a Force Buckler, I mean, bucklers are specifically forbidden from making Shield Rushs (pg 408 of Campaigns)

And he is still parrying after a move and attack, which we discussed on first playtest

Hmmm, actually! If we use the optional rule on pg 107 of Martial Arts, he CAN parry, he just can't block! Since he hit with his shield arm. Thats a cool optional rule

It also makes sense: you can't use the thing you attacked with to defend with, like with a committed attack. And given that you can't block beams with a shield, it makes a shield ideal for rushing.

But I think we should change things to allow him to parry beams. But that's something I talk about in the next iteration

(Also, because we're using Action rules, if we absolutely decided not to use the optional rule, he could STILL make a heroic charge and ignore the move-and-attack limitations)

I'm not sure about parrying missed attacks . . . his parry is now much lower though since he has already parried twice

Blowing up the grenade was fun, and she could have just as easily have killed him outrigbt so why not

What it really highlighted to me is that I need to allow these characters to take cover. Your early comment about "You can't treat mooks like this an expect them to be an interesting challenge" or something to that effect, is certainly proving to be true. They look like chumps. Real soldiers would take cover, which would force Kendra to maneuver and use her own grenades and she's perfectly adept at both. What happens when I make these guys mooks is that they short-change the possibilities of the characters.

Leylana killing the guy was funny, and I could totally see it happening in a movie, but I have utterly no idea how I would DM such, I mean, how does she hit him in the face when she is behind him? I have no idea! I probably would have randomly added an extra -2 or something, since skull is -7 from front, -5 from behind, so face is -5 from front, should be -7 from behind? Anyway, I am fairly sure Tactical Shooting allows Telegraphic Attacks at 'can actually touch' range, which is good for surprise attacks from behind . . . but again, here we are attacking from behind at a front hit location? Weird

There was some editing done. Originally, she tapped him on the shoulder and called out to him and then shot him. I removed her comment (because it was cheesy). I don't know if the rest got lost in the edit. But it was like the "Dodge this" scene in the Matrix.

I didn't like how low her roll was. If Telegraphic attacks aren't an option in tactical shooting, I'll add them in Iteration 4. I had been thinking about the same solution, in fact, and I expect you'll see a lot of gunplay-in-melee in a game featuring both blasters and force swords.

Where is the rule bucklers can only block once? I can remember 'shields can only block once' and from Martial Arts, 'shields iterate at -5', but I can't remember a buckler distinction.

I assume shields and bucklers are just the same.

Dun also would really love to get Weapon Master damage bonuses sometime, that would result in happiness, joy, and Star Wars style chopping even the cooler shinier types of battle droids in half in a single blow!

This iteration definitely had weapon master. I believe he even had the bonus. He should be dealing 8d+16 damage. He only has one chance to really hit someone and deals 24 damage. He might have rolled really low, but I think it's more likely that I just forgot. He should be dealing an average of 40 damage per hit.

I liked the shield, it was cool. House rule territory, but for my Primus Republic Campaign setting (Pseudo Fantasy 'I Can't Believe its Not Rome, if Rome had Airships and Guns and Things, Okay Yeah, it is Easy to Believe its Not Rome Now, but theres togas and recipes from Apicius and Mars and Minerva and such so there we go') which I've run a few campaigns in of different types one of the Things of Awesome was I wanted folks to be able to block gunfire with scutums (because scutums are Things of Awesome for Faux Fantasy Rome), so I allowed it with a perk. I also allowed 'Super Ranged Deceptive Attack' which DID work vs shields with a perk to. So epic shieldmen could stand tall against gunfire, and epic bowmen/gunmen could also drop shieldmen etc

The Primus Republic also involved the first use of Manasabres (technically they should have been Manaspathas or something, but Manasabre is pretty much the term we use for magical 'I can't believe its not a lightsabre') (based off Kuroshima's writeup in this thread http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=123386 ), and they worked fine! I allowed them to be instantly useful on a fast draw so you could have Manasabre Iajutsu

Here is a thread where you can see some discussion on blocking gunfire I started http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=90737

There is actually a Precognitive Block skill and a Force Sword / Force Buckler sword and board style in Pyramid 09 - Space Opera

The inability to block beams actually causes additional problems that cropped up in iteration 3. Specifically, it means the reflective force buckler does not work as advertised.

I liked that you rolled dodge, even though here it didn't actually make a difference . . . but it does establish the precedent that maybe in the future some dodges might happen and maybe deceptive attack wouldn't be a bad goal in the future

In the Action rules, mooks get to make a defense roll. I agree that it helps.

What is the point of them having armor if not to force people to shoot at weak points (or use hefty weapons suitable for hitting like a space going truck)? They die on one point of damage, so . . . if sidearms can knock through their armor easily they could just wear tshirts. Modern US military armor can stop a standard rifle shot cold if the shot hits the armor, and much non military armor can stop sidearms. I did notice that against the heavier weapons the armor wasn't so effective

There are more threats on a battlefield than direct-fire weapons. There are lighter weapons (a heavy blaster pistol does only 1 die less damage than a blaster carbine, and combat hardsuits can already basically ignore a carbine, which is my weapon of choice for combat. Really, your ideal point is right on the cusp of that: A soldier should barely be able to damage someone wearing their same armor (same idea with tanks). Right now, hardsuits are very much balanced around "I can ignore small arms fire", which is a lot for a run-of-the-mill mook. It's fine for elites, though.

I'd envision a scenario where an assault trooper wears a hardsuit, and a typical rifleman or a sniper wears something lighter.

Since this is Psi Wars, and we expect Psi to be a thing, an amusing note that does in some cases justify heavy armor / weak weapons. When I was playing X-Com, the final mission (this being the old DOS X-Com) has you up against a slew of mind controlling enemies. So my eventual solution after seeing my own guys massacre there buddies constantly was to A - put everyone in power armor, and B - Give everyone laser pistols. Now my guys weren't able to kill each other, and could still (though needing much more shots than with the heavier weapons) kill the enemies. The enemies who were busy mind controlling my guys and having them harmlessly zap each other

An interesting observation. You obliquely point out one of my concerns: Psi will not work like the Force. The Force is mostly a flashy thing: You can do a little psychokinesis, sometimes the GM says "And you sense something" and you can jump really far, and you sometimes get a vision and that's it. If you actually watch how its used 90% of the time in the movies, it doesn't do much. Contrast with how players would actually treat "Jedi Mind Tricks," it'd become a constant thing. Sith Assassins would Mind Trick their way up to their target, kill him in his sleep, and Mind Trick their way back out. People would literally use mind control to take over positions of power (a lot of fans speculate that Palpatine did this, but I don't think there's outright proof of it in the series), and use Precog to ferret out assassination attempts and to best decide where they should be and when to defeat their enemy. Imagine if Palpatine had been like Paul Atreides, and given that he's the only Force User left who has that sort of reach and power, he'd be the "best precog," and so he should know things like "If I send the Death Star against the rebellion, they will destroy it. The only path I can follow, the golden path, is to send Mara Jade to seduce a moisture farm-boy on Tatooine..."

Given that players will actively use their psi to solve problems, when I get to that iteration, I'm going to need to think carefully about how it impacts gameplay, knowing that players will actually use it. The result will certainly feel different from the more cinematic force. You'll get things like dueling precogs and paranoid mind-shielding strategies and such, which is as it should be in my opinion.

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

Neither of them did very well at zeroing in on the concept I wanted. Because both of them lacked Dual Weapon Attack. And since I couldn't really follow the concept I wanted, neither of them allow a focus on using a rifle either! Or a shield for that matter (not that I can really imagine using a shield), so from both I get the impression that the template is getting between me and the character I want

Dual Weapon Attack is something I'll get into in Iteration 4 (martial arts), though I'm not entirely certain it actually fits the purpose of a Bounty Hunter (even if it fits our image).

The new template is way more flexible, but . . . not in a way that helped. For instance, you have 3 talents. I have to go break open Talents, look up all 3 talents, and find out none of them have Criminology (which I wanted), and anyway, if I have to try to cross reference talents and skills from list then ugh, I'd be at this even longer

The three talents idea is neat, but the Spy handles her two-talents better, especially since I force you to pick one and then tag everything that is impacted by your choice. You can really see "Oh, an impersonator works like this and a crafty spy works like that" better than the bounty hunter. I think we're better off shifting the Bounty Hunter to a straight Tough Guy and removing the talent clutter. She's too broad now.

And the flexibility comes _after_ the important choices are made to a good extent, you are going to have 4points in Beam Weapons (Pistol) and thats your extent of choices for 'primary how do I make things die' (do we have stun settings? If so, thats also my primary choice for how do I make things not die)

Yes, blasters can have stun settings.

I also didn't like the inclusion of the full unmodified gunslinger, and only the full unmodified gunslinger. Full unmodified gunslinger is great if you want to use every weapon that exists (like Boba Fett, who had rockets, flamers, rifle, wrist blasters oh my. Totally fits for him), however, our template characters have neither the skills nor the ST to use every weapon in the book (we see how much encumbrance Kendra is eating just trying to carry two heavy blaster pistols). I can forgive Space for that much more readily, as Space predates modified Gunslinger, but not so much the New Template

I've never heard of this. I've heard of it for Weapon Master, but never for Gunslinger. Can you point me to an example? Cheaper gunslinger would certainly help deal with Kendra's expensive racial template. It would also fit the bounty hunter (and the frontier marshal) as she's very focused on pistols, while the other gunslinger, the commando, is necessarily competent with a variety of weapons.

I didn't get much setting feel from either, I mean, I got the idea that pistols were a good thing, but pistols being a good thing can be anything from Old West on forward, and I got the idea that I wasn't going to be using a lot of military grade hardware, and that was about it. I did make the odd notice that neither Patron (Employer) or Duty (Employer) were on either sheet. That was weird. I usually think of Bounty Hunters as having employers ranging from Friendly Joe's Bail Bonds to the Bounty Hunters Guild, the Bounty Hunters Guild in particular being prevalent in Star Wars

They seem to be mercenaries, men who are hired for one job and move on (hence the option for Code of Honor (Professional)) rather than people who work for a company. I would point out that your conflicts with the template seem to be more from having a different vision of what Bounty Hunters should be ("Why so much hand-to-hand? Why not a duty to an employer," the answers are "Because they grapple people and bring them in alive" and "because they are mercenaries who work for a reward, rather than a paycheck", not because the template is badly designed. At least, not in this case).

Similarly, they have an option for Shortsword, which isn't immediately obvious to you, but that's for the neurolash baton, another way of bringing in someone alive.

Hmmm, anyway, the Space Template is short, not very flexible . . . . the . . new template is way longer, but still doesn't really seem to be that much more flexible . . . it seems to give more options, but not in the most meaningful of ways. Not sure if that explains anything

It sounds to me like the second template is better (if I read between the lines and judge for what I'm looking for), but is hampered by being watered down. If I keep the added flexibility, but pick a single direction for the bounty hunter to go in ("Ranged weapons, street-type, tough guy, and not a clever trickster or a stealthy kidnapper") and then drill the template down on that, it'd be a big improvement.

What I've done in Iteration 2 is broaden them out to have more room to move, and made sure they cover enough necessary bases, and they do. You won't go "But you're missing this in the template." But now I need to ensure that they're really good at what they're good at, and not good at what they're not good at, and carefully articulate what those things are.

edit - I added the picture to the sheets I linked, on sheet2 of the sheet, labeled 'Pic'

Thanks!

[apoc527]

As I posted on your blog, it is so good that I would pay for it.

One thing I hope you are doing is keeping track of the oddities that you may want to change in a final iteration, like the strange rule that force bucklers can't Block blasters.

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by apoc527

As I posted on your blog, it is so good that I would pay for it.

One thing I hope you are doing is keeping track of the oddities that you may want to change in a final iteration, like the strange rule that force bucklers can't Block blasters.

I am, though you'll see it very clearly in Iteration 3 (at the end of each post that discusses some new rules, you'll see a slew of little notes. That's one way I keep track of this stuff).

There's also a lag in release. I'll be discussing something now ("Isn't it weird that force bucklers don't block blasters?") but I'll have actually already done my homework and research and noted it later on. For example, spoiler alert: In the Gear section of Iteration 3, I've already upgraded the force buckler to the reflective force buckler, because shields in Star Wars (especially those in the video game) bounce beams. It also makes sense that if a force sword can bounce beams (being a sword made out of force wards), then a force buckler should be able to do the same and they should use the same mechanics, so obviously the Force Buckler is reflective... but despite the fact that the force buckler clearly has rules for bouncing beams, it has no way of actually blocking them, thus doesn't work.

Answer: You can block beams with a force buckler. Obviously. That's clearly the intent of the rule for the reflective force buckler. Yes, it's highly cinematic, but as slowly as beams move in star wars (and thus psi wars), it fits with how players see things. They won't think twice about being able to block a beam with a shield.

Likewise, I've already made most of the proposed modifications for the Bounty Hunter, it's just that the template won't drop until sometime in... early May, I think (Iteration 3 is huge).

And when I'm not making posts like that, I have 6 folders worth of material that I'm sorting through, and that's one reason for this project: To turn the piles of notes and files that I generate when I'm thinking and tinkering into a finished, semi-edited, readable work that other people can use, so that when someone says "Oh man, Mailanka, your Psi-Wars campaign sounds awesome, can you show me your notes?" I don't stand there stammering apologetically about how messy a GM I am.

[Kalzazz]

Well, Dual Weapon Attacks are all cool and shiny, and you mentioned it, and dual wielding catgirls just sound cool . . . . however, it is not just the lack of DWA (which really, does not often make a lot of sense, cool as all get out, but sense?), but why not use rifles? I mean, if you force me to imagine a bounty hunter, I picture somebody with a TactiCool to the max AR-15, sure he has a sidearm as a backup, but thats not his main thing

If a cop is going to actually go in and serve a warrant and arrest someone, he often gets his rifle out of his car and goes in with his buddies if the suspect may be dangerous (and our Space Bounty Hunter isn't going after some boring old failure to appear for traffic court)

Sidearms are for -
A - backup when you aren't actually planning to schedule a rumble, much like swords actually. You can wear your pistol / sword as you go about your daily business
B - for cool Gun Fu, because sidearms are the American equivalent of a katana or arming sword, they are the thing which Heroes of Justice / Evildoers wear which shows they are Real Warriors TM as opposed to unarmed peasants. In which case, two pistols can be far cooler than one
C - If you can't carry a gun openly, for instance, if you are not a proper Hero of Justice and the cops would come down on you. Bounty Hunters however tend to be decked out in all proper TactiCool getup with 'BOND ENFORCEMENT' in big letters when they get the guns out and move in, and frequently communicate with the local constabulary so as to avoid this problem of being mistaken for badguys. Or they operate in lawless frontier type areas where carrying a rifle to the local grocery store is no big

You don't let them focus on two pistols and you don't let them focus on a rifle. This is an issue.

Also, the bounty hunter isn't very strong. Strength is a big thing for succeeding in wrestling matches. And since stun weapons exist, why not stun the target with your weapon? I'm not sure what the rules are offhand for switching between settings, but if it takes a ready, then Bounty Hunters need the Lightning Fingers perk from Tactical Shooting pg 39 to switch settings between stun and lethal readily.

pg 25 of Tactical Shooting has rules for touch distance gunplay, including Telegraphic Attack, but they don't call it telegraphic attack (I don't know why not, what is +4 to hit, +2 to defend if not telegraphic attack?)

Limited gunslinger is from this forum post
http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...3&postcount=10
It also is on pg 16 of Gun Fu under 'Gun Rack'

I certainly normally think of a bounty hunter working for an employer . . . I remember the Star Wars Bounty Hunters Guild, and Stephanie Plums cousin Vinnie.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Bounty_Hunters'_Guild

Or on the bounty hunter catgirl topic, the main character of Hyper Police is a bounty hunter catgirl who works for an employer (for at least part of the show) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyper_Police

So not saying its a requirement, but it seems like a reasonable option to have listed on the template as a choice

Heroic Charge, pg 131 Martial Arts specifically notes 'Likewise, you’re still subject to defensive penalties (no parry or retreat).'

I'm not sure how much cover would make a difference, but I would be interested to seeing more of it in play. I mean, your face needs to be exposed to shoot, cover doesn't penalize shooting at exposed targets, Kendra has already been shooting them in the face . . . so?

Leylana shooting someone from behind in the face . . . is still . . . really hard to wrap my mind around how that works. What is tapping someone on the shoulder to get them to look at you? Some kind of deceptive attack? Really, it is cool, but it is something I have no idea how to DM. I have no particular issue with her roll being that low, I mean, its a face shot and she isn't Carlos Hathcock, but the part of Tactical Shooting I mentioned could help. I can assure you that were such a thing to be attempted at my table it would probably result in 20 minutes of rule diving, a all hands on deck rules discussion where we tear through all the books we have, and a forum post, and then I let it work because its funny and I have no idea how to adjudicate it probably

As for armor, I am not sure I agree . . . . you want to wear armor that will hopefully stop enemy attacks. Modern body armor for soldiers stops rifle attacks, modern body armor for cops stops pistol/shotgun attacks . . . Vietnam era armor often did NOT stop rifle attacks, and often soldiers didnt bother wearing it

A M4 carbine round being stopped by Interceptor body armor seems perfectly okay to me

Kendra being forced to use superior skill to make called shots, Dun being forced to close to melee to hit like a truck, and Leylana being forced to use sneakiness in order to kill armored foes? I think that sounds fine

However, I am very much cool with their being lower tiers of enemies that wear less armor and such. That was one issue with WEG Star Wars d6, Stormtroopers, supposedly the elite of the Empire, are goblin grade cannon fodder that level 1 characters can win a rumble with. So in order to challenge PCs as they get more powerful 'Oh look, you run into . . . . Super Purple Palette Swap Stormtroopers!'

That is actually an issue with Star Wars type stuff . . . . I mean, the heroes obviously want to fight Stormtroopers . . . but how do you handle PCs leveling up? I mean, in fantasy you go from 'you fight big rats and goblins' to 'you fight orks and ogres' all the way to 'you fight deities' etc, very nice progression

My generic low tier Space type enemies are gangs of goons armed with an assortment of cheapy AKMs, Sten Guns, and Mosin Nagant knockoffs fresh from somebodies garage 3d printer, usually wearing no armor, or people wearing last TL castoff armor and bearing last TL castoff weapons at best.

[Kalzazz]

The Force Buckler thing is clearly an issue I have with Star Wars as well . . . . here these Gungans are with these sweet sweet shields that reflect everything. And . . . . noone else uses them? Seriously, shieldmen seem like they would be a THING.

My 'solution' from the Primus Republic campaign was that 'shields can be used to block guns, but you need some mininum level of coolness in the form of a perk to do it, so its for cool peoples, not riffraffs'

If you fight a squad of Priman Republic Legionaries drawn from the 1st Cohort of the Legion, then sure, you totally expect those guys to be doing sweet awesome things with the shields. Some ork rabble? Not so much. Some Named Ork Chieftain? Sure!

The Precognitive Parry option from Pyramid 9 kinda works on that principle of 'mininum coolness quotient and buy in needed'

[Mailanka]

Originally Posted by Kalzazz

Well, Dual Weapon Attacks are all cool and shiny, and you mentioned it, and dual wielding catgirls just sound cool . . . . however, it is not just the lack of DWA (which really, does not often make a lot of sense, cool as all get out, but sense?), but why not use rifles? I mean, if you force me to imagine a bounty hunter, I picture somebody with a TactiCool to the max AR-15, sure he has a sidearm as a backup, but thats not his main thing

I'll give you several reasons. First, where possible, I want to focus on pistols over rifles, because rifles (especially sniper rifles), if allowed to gain pre-eminence, will quickly widen the field of battle beyond the point where a melee character becomes viable. You'll notice I've done all the fights in pistol or shotgun range, and the largest gun (except for the Heavy's heavy blaster) have been carbines. If I encouraged rifles, then rifle-wielders would try to fight at ranges more like -10 rather than -3, and then the force sword wielder doesn't have much hope. That might change when they start to get considerable force leap, and I've tentatively added a laser sniper rifle in the next iteration, but we have to be careful when we move away from pistols and into rifles.

Second, boba fett is a terrible bounty hunter. A good bounty hunter arrests people, he doesn't kill them. A sniper kills people. The point of a pistol is that it can be holstered and drawn relatively quickly, while a longarm is harder to quick draw. It's also less wieldy in the close-in circumstances that will happen when you go in to get someone. That's almost inevitably close-in quarters, usually urban conflict. In those circumstances, people tend to carry shotguns, carbines and pistols, not rifles.

Third, a bounty hunter walks the mean streets of crime. Getting a pistol on the street is easier than getting a rifle, and it's also easier to use. A bounty hunter is going to get into bar fights, or have negotiation with crime bosses that go south, or get jumped by thugs in an alleyway. These are all situations where having a pistol is a better choice than having a rifle. Your typical D&D rogue carries knives and shortswords rather than spears for similar reasons.

Finally, as you note yourself, the pistol is typically flashier and more cinematic than a rifle. They are the katana of the gunplay world, and psi wars is cinematic and flashy. When you combine it with all the reasons above, the bounty hunter as a pistol-slinger makes a lot of sense, and looks right.

That said, I do have the option to learn the rifle in the next template, along with reduced hand-to-hand (but the option to improve it), and things like shortsword, or the ability to go nuts with pistols. But pistols will remain the default and prime skill of a bounty hunter, in part because we're already seeing the bounty hunter as a pistol character, and in part for the reasons I have stated.

There are rifle-wielders. Commandos, for example, start with rifles and the recon character is a full-on sniper (though don't look too closely at the Iteration 2 commando. I just gave them a good once over for Iteration 3, and my goodness did they have problems. Fixed now, though). I can see the assassin with them too, but I'll probably go for melee instead, because the typical Star Wars assassin seems more like a ninja than a sniper, and to keep combat close up, that might fit best.

EDIT: It should also be noted that Star Wars bounty hunters are much closer to hit men than they are to actual, real-life bounty hunters. The Psi Wars bounty hunter, especially since its initial inspiration was the Space template, is much closer to an actual bounty hunter than a hit man, though they're more gunslinger-y, I think, than either.

Also, the bounty hunter isn't very strong.

ST 11, one of the strongest templates thus far in Psi Wars. I have a hard time justifying more, because it's just less useful in Psi-Wars than in other games. Gear just isn't that heavy, and you have very few weapons that benefit from your strength. Beam weapons have shockingly low ST requirements, and force swords don't use your ST for damage. I can give a wrestler +1 wrestling for 4 points, or +1 ST for 10, and given the lack of utility ST has for nearly everything else, I prefer the former option.

pg 25 of Tactical Shooting has rules for touch distance gunplay, including Telegraphic Attack, but they don't call it telegraphic attack (I don't know why not, what is +4 to hit, +2 to defend if not telegraphic attack?)

I'll have to study those. I think it'll come up often, given how much melee happens in Psi Wars.

Limited gunslinger is from this forum post
http://forums.sjgames.com/showpost.p...3&postcount=10
It also is on pg 16 of Gun Fu under 'Gun Rack'

I think you can forgive me for not knowing about a single post, but I had missed the reference in Gun Fu. I'll add it as an option to the Bounty Hunter.

Heroic Charge, pg 131 Martial Arts specifically notes 'Likewise, you’re still subject to defensive penalties (no parry or retreat).'

That's interesting. I had ignored it for awhile because I wanted to get around the Move-And-Attack problem in a different way in the one game where it came up. I should remember that in Psi Wars, though, as I'll use it more often.

I'm not sure how much cover would make a difference, but I would be interested to seeing more of it in play. I mean, your face needs to be exposed to shoot, cover doesn't penalize shooting at exposed targets, Kendra has already been shooting them in the face . . . so?

If you're prepping a grenade, you can be completely behind cover while you ready the grenade first to pull it out, then ready it again to set the smart timer and such, and then you'd only show up to throw the grenade. The problem here is that he's just standing there while he pulls out a grenade, and then is surprised when the gunslinger shoots the grenade. Or him. Or whatever.

As for armor, I am not sure I agree . . . . you want to wear armor that will hopefully stop enemy attacks. Modern body armor for soldiers stops rifle attacks, modern body armor for cops stops pistol/shotgun attacks . . . Vietnam era armor often did NOT stop rifle attacks, and often soldiers didnt bother wearing it

A M4 carbine round being stopped by Interceptor body armor seems perfectly okay to me

However, I am very much cool with their being lower tiers of enemies that wear less armor and such. That was one issue with WEG Star Wars d6, Stormtroopers, supposedly the elite of the Empire, are goblin grade cannon fodder that level 1 characters can win a rumble with. So in order to challenge PCs as they get more powerful 'Oh look, you run into . . . . Super Purple Palette Swap Stormtroopers!'

We'll see how it plays out in the next playtest, then. There's a reason I do this in iterations: It doesn't have to be perfect, just better than it was before. I think some of my readers find that a little frustrating, because they want a finished product and they sense that I'm partly doing this to buy myself some time, but I think the final product will be much stronger for it (though for future settings and material, I won't force people to slog through a journal like this)

[Kalzazz]

As a note, while I am of course open to having my mind changed, I think that the step by step discussion is at least as interesting, if not more interesting than whatever the final product will be (not that I don't expect the final product to be cool, but well, I expect most of the target audience has seen LOTS of various and sundry 'and here we have a campaign setting', but seeing the campaign setting actually being built, with reasons for it and such, and being able to actually ask questions of the author, that is awesome)

So I certainly would love to see more 'hoods off, this is why I did this' stuff alongside what you actually did . . . . I mean, I may or may not agree with what you did, or why you did it, but it is a waaaaaay better 'teach a man to fish' exercise the more examples of the actual fishing and not just the resultant fish you can see

This is actually an interesting enough thread I am willing (within reason) to do actual homework assignments that are challenged such as 'make a character using template' or 'answer why I am not using these cinematic rules'

And I have even started using some of the more cinematic notions due to the discussion, old dogs / new tricks not withstanding

Anyway, so don't feel pressed to go straight to 'and heres the finished product' stage on my account. I am way more interested in seeing the evolution of a template and reading explanations of how/why the template was made than I am in just seeing a finished template etc

I probably just come across as impatient because its exciting and I want to see more!