The default level of my skill is higher than the buyed level

[Joaorevilo]

I have the skill Karate on level 14, and according to GURPS 3e - Martial Arts:
"Art and Sport skills have the same base and default as the equivalent combat skills, with defaults between them at -3."
This means that my Karte Art skill is on 11, but i spent 1 points on it (making it level 9), what should i do?

[Celjabba]

Are you playing in 3rd edition or 4th edition ?

In 4e :
I Guess you have DX 11 (so that 1 point in K:Art give you a skill of 9)

You would roll against the best score (default 11 in this case) - you don't get worse by spending cp :)
Getting from 11 to 12 would cost 4 cp, so the cp you spent on Karate art doesn't change anything.

It does mean you are trained in the skill of karate:art, not simply rolling at default, so any bonus that would be only available to trained user is available. Sadly, I cannot think of any for Karate:Art.
Going the other way, if the primary skill was karate:art, 'wasting' 1 cp on karate would give you the damage bonus and other karate benefits.

In 3e : I would need to grab my books, been a while.

[Mr_Sandman]

If you are using 3rd edition, see the sidebar that starts on page 44 of the Basic Set: "Defaulting to Other Skills". Your skill doesn't go down by spending points on it. You start with a base of 11 - defaulting from the Karate skill of 14. To increase Karate (art) from 11 to 12 (raising its level from DX to DX+1) would cost 4 points. Spending 1 point doesn't lower your skill, but it isn't enough to raise it.

(The same rule in 4th edition is on p. 173)

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by Joaorevilo

I have the skill Karate on level 14, and according to GURPS 3e - Martial Arts:
"Art and Sport skills have the same base and default as the equivalent combat skills, with defaults between them at -3."
This means that my Karte Art skill is on 11, but i spent 1 points on it (making it level 9), what should i do?

Actually the point you spent didn't change it. It's still 11. You're just one point closer to buying it up to a level that will increase it to 12.

As a moderate digression, "Karate Art" and "Karate Sport" and "Karate Combat" really shouldn't be separate skills. They should be Techniques or Specializations as of 4e.

[Mr_Sandman]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

As a moderate digression, "Karate Art" and "Karate Sport" and "Karate Combat" really shouldn't be separate skills. They should be Techniques or Specializations as of 4e.

Extending the digression a bit, by RAW they aren't, even in 4e, according to p.184 of the Basic Set. Whether they 'should be' is a matter of taste. If they were treated as techniques, I could see it causing some conflict as to whether other techniques default off them, and at what level. Calling them specialties wouldn't really change anything, since specialties are separate skills with defaults to each other anyway.

[AlexanderHowl]

You could just have an overarching skill one difficulty level higher. For example, Karate would be a VH skill and Karate Art, Karate Combat, and Karate Sport would all be specialties of Karate (this would improve the defaults somewhat, but I do not think that would be necessarily unbalanced).

[Varyon]

When buying up from defaults in 4e, you are treated as though you already spent enough points to get to your default level, and only need to pay to get to the next level. With DX 11 and Karate 14, you have Karate Art 11. You are treated as though you spent the [4] necessary to get Karate Art to 11, thus can spend another [4] to boost to 12 (although spending that [4] on Karate would do the same thing as well as increase Karate to 15; this is a general issue with buying up from defaults). The [1] you spent doesn't change your level in Karate Art, but does mean you count as trained in it, letting you do things like using IQ-based Karate Art to identify the specific kata someone else is doing.

As others have noted, however, it really makes more sense for Sport/Art to be Techniques or similar. That's not the way GURPS handles it by default, however.

[maximara]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

Actually the point you spent didn't change it. It's still 11. You're just one point closer to buying it up to a level that will increase it to 12.

As a moderate digression, "Karate Art" and "Karate Sport" and "Karate Combat" really shouldn't be separate skills. They should be Techniques or Specializations as of 4e.

Originally Posted by Mr_Sandman

Extending the digression a bit, by RAW they aren't, even in 4e, according to p.184 of the Basic Set. Whether they 'should be' is a matter of taste. If they were treated as techniques, I could see it causing some conflict as to whether other techniques default off them, and at what level. Calling them specialties wouldn't really change anything, since specialties are separate skills with defaults to each other anyway.

I think some of the confusion might be from GURPS Update: "The difficulty and defaults of the Combat Art and Combat Sport skills are the same as for the corresponding combat skills, some of which have changed in Fourth Edition."

Also p 184 says "A combat skill, its Art form, and its Sport form default among themselves at -3."

So if you know Sword (Katana)-X you know Katana (Sport) and Katana (Art) at X-3. Even more confusing, if you know Katana (Sport/Art)-X then you know Sword (Katana) at X-3.

[corwyn]

I think my next game will have all defaults be techniques and be considered bought skills with regards to further defaults.

[ArchonShiva]

As soon as you have [1] in a skill, it stops being a default. It’s still at 11, though.
Some other effects of having [1] in a skill where it doesn’t affect skill level:

You are considered trained in the skill, not using it at default;
You can default from Karate Art 11 (instead of no defaulting from defaults);
You qualify for an ability with prerequisite: Karate Art;
If someone “drains” or “steals” your Karate skill, you still have Karate Art 9.