Layerd Armour and other ways of Improving DR

[VariousRen]

I've got a character who has come into a fair chunk of money, and the group likely has both further profit and considerable danger in it's future. My armour is starting to feel a little inadequate, and I'm looking into ways to improve it.

Currently I've got a suit of Heavy Chain (DR 5/3) and carry a Heavy Shield. I'm a primarily defensive character and caster, so movement speed isn't much of an issue. Any weight less than about 120 pounds is acceptable, and so layering armour seems like the way to go.

So first: Layered armour rules apply if the chance of hitting a hit location is greater than 3 in 6. Does this apply to breastplates that only cover the front?

Second: Layered armour applies to layering two suits on top of each other. Is it reasonable to have an armourer design a suit of armour that is twice as thick (double layer of rings perhaps) to avoid having to layer?

Third: The world is TL 2, with TL 3 weapons and armour possible but expensive (2x price). What types of armour should I be paying attention to for the best return for my money? Chainmail seems like a good price/DR/weight point, as well as segmented plate. I get the feeling that TL 3 equipment would end up being too expensive to be worth it(note that it's not CF +1, it's x2 to the final price).

Finally, Fourth: Weight might end up being the factor that limits how much I can wear, what sort of modifiers should I be aware of for reducing armour weight?

[Culture20]

By heavy chain do you mean double-maille? Maille is your best bet for an extra layer since it's easy to don and remove. Meet a new friend who needs some armor? Tada! You have them covered.
Is magic an option? If you're using Magic, low-mid level enchantments can be done piecemeal via quick and dirty method vastly reducing their cost. In my games, I allow layered enchanted armor if someone wants to bother layering armor.

[VariousRen]

Originally Posted by Culture20

By heavy chain do you mean double-maille? Maille is your best bet for an extra layer since it's easy to don and remove. Meet a new friend who needs some armor? Tada! You have them covered.
Is magic an option? If you're using Magic, low-mid level enchantments can be done piecemeal via quick and dirty method vastly reducing their cost. In my games, I allow layered enchanted armor if someone wants to bother layering armor.

Heavy chain mail from low tech instant armour. Magic is an option, so I'll be looking into Lighten enchantments on everything at the very least.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by VariousRen

Heavy chain mail from low tech instant armour. Magic is an option, so I'll be looking into Lighten enchantments on everything at the very least.

With Magic in play you absolutely want to get it enchanted piecemeal. It will be the cheapest and best way to enhance your armor. More DR than you'll get from layering and without weight or DX penalties.

[weby]

Are you using basic set or low tech rules?

In low tech the clear choice for good but expensive TL 2 armor is bronze plate.

At considerably less than 120 lb you could have:
heavy plate in torso: $16 000 32 lb DR 9
medium plate in legs: $10 000 20lb DR 6
medium plate arms: $5 000 10lb DR 6
medium plate on feet: $1 000 2lb DR 6
medium plate on hands: $1 000 2lb DR 6
Heavy plate full helm: $4 800 9.6 lb DR 9
total of 75.6lb and $37 800

If you have more money and want the heaver things you could always go with heavy plate in all locations and perhaps use the heavy plate rules on lt 109 to get up to DR 15 on torso and head....

And if you still feel like too lightly loaded and dexterous you could place one or two layers of heavy mail under the torso plate, but mostly the DX penalties make it less useful.

For lightening the armor LT has expert and masterful tailoring rules.

[Calvin]

Pyramid 3-52 Low-Tech II has extensive rules for armour design. You could very easily use them to create your double layered/double strength mail.

Speaking generally, you're probably going to end up with double the cost and weight if you also want double DR. Don time might also double, but I'm not certain.

As for layering, it's still not a bad idea in certain areas. It mainly depends on whether or not you're using the extended hit location table (with veins, joints, etc), and the harsh armour gaps rules.

If you've got 3/6 coverage to work with you can usually cover all the joints and other vulnerable areas.

If you're using armour gaps heavy layered leather is a good pick for areas that are not covered by your regular armour. Again it should total less than 3/6.

And even without those rules, a pectoral plate is super awesome. For just 1/6 coverage you can add extra armour to the vitals. Even in games where I'm lightly armoured with leather, light mail, etc, I usually take as heavy a pectoral plate as I can afford. And if you want to you can go up to a 3/6 size pectoral plate to get the extra armour half the time on torso hits.

If you do go for 1/6th coverage you only pay 666.66$ and 5.33lbs for an extra 9 DR on the vitals. And that's on top of your 5/3 from the mail. Maybe that's too expensive, but Medium plate or Brigandine still add a lot.

A pectoral plate is my go to armour upgrade.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Calvin

If you're using armour gaps heavy layered leather is a good pick for areas that are not covered by your regular armour. Again it should total less than 3/6.

Only chest vitals, from the front. You can still get hit in the vitals via the abdomen, from the sides and back, and on a 1 on 1d6 on any attack to the torso.

[Calvin]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

Only chest vitals, from the front. You can still get hit in the vitals via the abdomen, from the sides and back, and on a 1 on 1d6 on any attack to the torso.

You can buy it for both front and back if you pay for the full weight. And arguably you could also cover the abdomen if you pay for 1/6th of the torso instead of 1/6th of the upper chest. Though it's not quite a "pectoral" plate then, the result is the same.

I guess you can get hit from the side but if you're careful with your facing you can ensure that targets nearly always have to go through the extra 3-9DR.

EDIT: My math in my previous post was also assuming the full coverage "pectoral", it's even less expensive if it's only the chest vitals.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Calvin

You can buy it for both front and back if you pay for the full weight. And arguably you could also cover the abdomen if you pay for 1/6th of the torso instead of 1/6th of the upper chest. Though it's not quite a "pectoral" plate then, the result is the same.

You can't put rigid armor on the abdomen. A plate that covered all your vital organs from the front and back would make it impossible to bend at the waist.

I guess you can get hit from the side but if you're careful with your facing you can ensure that targets nearly always have to go through the extra 3-9DR.

You are still vulnerable to torso hits that roll a 1 on 1d and reach vitals that way, only torso armor will prevent this.

[Calvin]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

You can't put rigid armor on the abdomen. A plate that covered all your vital organs from the front and back would make it impossible to bend at the waist.

That's assuming you're using the optional rules that require that. But if you are you can just use Heavy Mail, etc, though you'd need a garment to attach it to. But since this is about layering armour we've already got that. The rules call it a pectoral "plate" but don't even require that it be made of rigid armour. And logically there's no reason a properly anchored (like to existing armor) sheet of mail wouldn't work.

EDIT: Though I guess this caps the abdomen-vitals armour boost (without the custom armour design from low tech 2) at 6 or something for jousting mail. Segmented plate remains an option on the abdomen, though it's a max of 5 DR.

As for not being able to bend, you would be able to bend and that's why side hits are still an issue. Plate on the front, plate on the back, nothing on the sides.

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

You are still vulnerable to torso hits that roll a 1 on 1d and reach vitals that way, only torso armor will prevent this.

I'm certain that this is not the case. Otherwise you'd have a situation where you couldn't deliberately target the vitals past the plate, but could get there accidentally. The vitals being hit on a 1 out of 1d6 is the entire reason that 1/6th coverage is the minimum required to protect against vitals hits.

You hit the vitals 1/6th the time because sometimes you're lucky and the vitals are inside the bit of torso you stuck your sword in. If the plate is meant to protect the vitals, then it's going to be protecting the vitals.