Splitting up the Thief talent

[ecz]

Originally Posted by tbeard1999

I wouldn't split them up. Most thieves are going to take the entire package and talent creep will slow character generation down (which is a major TFT strength).

I agree.
My opinion is in minority, but I feel the need to say that among all the possible changes, this looks expecially NOT necessary.
In fact before the starting of thread nobody has mentioned this topic, unless I missed something ( quite possible) .

I loved the overarching traits of the thief talent. But probably I' too tied to the old game to appreciate some changes.

[Skarg]

Originally Posted by David Bofinger

It's always bothered me that Knock is so powerful compared with Thief. It makes a bit of a mockery of the locksmithing skill set, that it's uniformly inferior to just one of the tools in the Swiss Army Knife that is wizardry.

Bothered me too, and some players who had the Thief talent.

Mainly just that Knock unlocks any physical lock. Seems to me a little like that "divination" element I'd rather weren't there. Magic should be able to hold a door shut, and probably to lock and unlock a door that has easy enough controls to do so (e.g. there is a key in the lock on the other side, or a lever to lock or unlock it from one side, or is a very simple mechanism). But it seems to me it would both make more sense and also be more interesting as well as better "balanced" (fun) if thieves and mechanicians' efforts were something an IQ 10 spell didn't overpower / bypass. That is, if there is no way to easily operate a lock, then Knock shouldn't be able to unlock a complicated physical lock (because it doesn't "know" what to do).

[howitzer]
However, by the same sort of reasoning, I would think there could/should be able to be a spell that would hold a door closed and not really be subject to lockpicking. Maybe that would be a different spell, though? Which might have a time limit, maintenance cost, or other limitation/workaround?
[/howitzer]

[JLV]

Originally Posted by Skarg

[joke] (And everyone who knows it is DX 14 and can pick locks and pockets and lie really well.) [/joke]

You've been reading David Eddings again, haven't you? ;-)

Originally Posted by ecz

I agree.
My opinion is in minority, but I feel the need to say that among all the possible changes, this looks expecially NOT necessary.
In fact before the starting of thread nobody has mentioned this topic, unless I missed something ( quite possible) .

I loved the overarching traits of the thief talent. But probably I' too tied to the old game to appreciate some changes.

It was brought up back in January or February, I think. I don't recall a particularly exhaustive discussion on the subject (at least compared to some we've had on this forum), but I think that was because a lot of us agreed that "Thief" and "Master Thief" were too generic for our taste... ;-)

[Nils_Lindeberg]

When it comes to splitting up talents in general.

I like it, but go all the way! Change every talent into 1 point talents. It won't be hard to split up most of them into sub units so they can be learned piece meal or selectively.

It is sooo boring saving up for a 3 point talent and not getting a proper use out of it until next year. Either that or make proper rules for studying talents.

[zot]

Originally Posted by Nils_Lindeberg

When it comes to splitting up talents in general.

I like it, but go all the way! Change every talent into 1 point talents. It won't be hard to split up most of them into sub units so they can be learned piece meal or selectively.

It is sooo boring saving up for a 3 point talent and not getting a proper use out of it until next year. Either that or make proper rules for studying talents.

I totally agree.

Also, I'd like to see more interesting prereqs for profession-ish talents like UC and Thief along the lines of "at least two of: Locksmith, Silent Movement, Streetwise, or Pickpocket" so characters with "higher level" talents aren't so similar.

[Oneiros]

Another vote for splitting the talent up. The Thief “bundle” always felt too much like a “class” in the parlance of another famous RPG. I like having those skills more mix and matchable to create more unique characters

[JLV]

What Oneiros said.

[Soyt Gose]

I've always been a fan of allowing (encouraging) as much diversity in character development as possible, even though that sometimes winds up in players protesting "What do you mean that I can do this but not this (other thing they claim is similar)?" It works OK in the TFT system because it addresses that issue by allowing players to give it a try anyway but just with an additional dice or two.

[Tolenkar]

Yes. Please split them up, Steve. It just gives greater flexibility to character creation.

-Tolenkar