Wall tanking

[corwyn]

So I ran a demo the other day and one of the players (who had played once) put heavy structure and two big lasers (for long range) on one side and then hugged the other side to a wall the entire duel. Quite effective, if boring, tactic. He only lost because all three opponents spent at least one attack on him every turn. All three final cars were down to 1-2 hp on the PP in the final turn. How would you counter this tactic?

[philreed]

Originally Posted by corwyn

How would you counter this tactic?

Personally, I would team up with everyone else and wipe that player out. And then never invite them to another game. Life is too short to play with someone who isn't looking to have fun.

[Aleph]

You could counter with the big, punchy weapons that could strip the structure away quickly (depending on the point values you are playing at). Once that is gone, so is the advantage of that tactic.

You could also try to get in close and outside of the single firing arc he has armed, staying behind or in front of him, and hitting his weaker front or rear.

If you are inclined to collisions, while you'd only do armor/structure damage on his tough side for the initial impact, if you keep pushing, the next collision will cause damage to his side that hits the wall, where he has sacrificed defense. But you'd have to be willing to take it twice yourself for this tactic.

Or if you can withstand being in his firing arc for a bit, you can force him into collisions with the walls or other obstacles by boxing him in and not giving him the space to maneuver.

[Aleph]

If it's a problem that comes up often, and you want to discourage the tactic in general, then you could do it with arena design.

Just state before the game that in your arenas, the crowd is armed. In the Combat phase, after every player has made their attacks, any car that is within 1 car length (or whatever you decide) of an arena wall is subject to a Hand Cannon attack from the crowd on the side of their car nearest to the arena wall. Starting with the first player and then going around the table.

[Sam Mitschke]

Did he also armor up the front and back of his car, or just the side facing away from the wall?

I would have absolutely closed the distance to take away the primary benefit of his lasers. Most weapons of equivalent cost have a more-reliable damage output and a higher maximum damage potential than lasers.

[corwyn]

Originally Posted by Sam Mitschke

Did he also armor up the front and back of his car, or just the side facing away from the wall?

I would have absolutely closed the distance to take away the primary benefit of his lasers. Most weapons of equivalent cost have a more-reliable damage output and a higher maximum damage potential than lasers.

No structure on other sides. All 4 cars ended up in one corner of the arena at fairly short range.

[Tom H.]

Originally Posted by Aleph

If it's a problem that comes up often, and you want to discourage the tactic in general, then you could do it with arena design.

I like the arena design solution.

Here is my twist:
Have the design motivate vehicle movement.

For example, there could be a point system that rewards capturing "flags" or bypassing checkpoints.

Other less contrived but less effective ideas:

a. Require distinct arena entrances and exits forcing vehicles to eventually cross unsafe territory.

b. Maybe there could be a "timer" that disqualifies a contestant that shelters too long or avoids combat too much.

[Sam Mitschke]

I don't believe it's a problem that needs solving. He came in dead last in a 4-player game. It's not a particularly effective strategy in 6e — just a boring one — and y'all DID counter it.

I would get in his way and make him either turn away or ram my car. If he tried this tactic over multiple games, I would equip a large rear gun and drive in front of him. He'd have to either commit fully and keep taking shots in his nose, or turn away from the wall and expose his weak side.

[corwyn]

Originally Posted by philreed

Personally, I would team up with everyone else and wipe that player out. And then never invite them to another game. Life is too short to play with someone who isn't looking to have fun.

Well, that seems a bit harsh, especially with a second time player, first time designer. I'll probably run some more games at that venue, so we'll see what he does. I mentioned that it was pretty cheesy, and he was ganged up a bit, so...

[Parody]

Originally Posted by corwyn

Well, that seems a bit harsh, especially with a second time player, first time designer. I'll probably run some more games at that venue, so we'll see what he does. I mentioned that it was pretty cheesy, and he was ganged up a bit, so...

I'd also add that wall crawlers have been a common arena design for the entire time I've played Car Wars, going back to the 80s. If you were to kickban everyone who tries that design style you'd run out of players pretty quickly.

If possible, vary up your arena/duel setting choices so your players try different ideas. In-game, attacking their weaker sides and/or ganging up on the dangerous opponent are both reasonable responses to me.

Have fun!