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Old 12-16-2018, 12:49 PM   #11
gmillerd
 
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

The Transcendent appearance seems purposely capped out. But there doesn't seem to be anything capped on the reaction bonus. Like proposed, charisma, voice, misc perks, temporary enhancements due to skill, etc can drive the bonus higher.

The effects described at Transcendent and beyond seem to be gaze effects/afflictions more than aesthetic qualities.

This seems even more clear on the negative side of the trait, when mind bending 'ugly' effects. Which isn't an appearance aesthetic, but a effects/affliction.

I don't recall where, but somewhere there is a discussion / article on aesthetic relativism on the trait itself (and how appearance is so often a un-discounted hook for assaults/ hooks, etc; enemy disadvantaged, thanks)

I would think that specializations and effects/afflictions are all you have left in the battles between Lady Galadriel and her peers.
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Old 12-16-2018, 01:54 PM   #12
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

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Originally Posted by Alonsua View Post
So Horrific gives -6 to reaction rolls while Transcendent gives an average of +5 to reaction rolls. In addition, a simple nymph has transcendent appearance (Dungeon Fantasy 3, page 9). How are we supposed to be able to differentiate a mythological creature from a deity?

Therefore, letīs create a new level of superior appearance averaging +6 for the goddess Aphrodite:
How could it be called?
What would be an appropriate description?


I advocate for:
Aphrodisiac/Apollonian: Both gods and mortals can not get enough of your devastating beauty/handsomeness and irresistible sensual charms. Your unbearable beauty/handsomeness can even inspire divine awe.

Rules:
1. Awe and Terror have already been accounted for.
The correct term would be Deific Beauty. Note: Any deity with this level of appearance would have Awe, Terror, and Charisma.
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Old 12-16-2018, 03:07 PM   #13
lwcamp
 
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

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Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
The correct term would be Deific Beauty. Note: Any deity with this level of appearance would have Awe, Terror, and Charisma.
Not to mention possible deity specific powers with the Sense Based (vision) limitation. As an example, Aphrodite might have affliction(lecherousness, vision based, malediction, area effect, etc.) so that any who see her are overcome with lust. Others might have Mind Control (worship me) or other powers to represent their particular realm.

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Old 12-16-2018, 03:15 PM   #14
Vaevictis Asmadi
 
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

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Originally Posted by Astromancer View Post
Note: Any deity with this level of appearance would have Awe, Terror, and Charisma.
Only in some settings. Not every setting has deities who engage in mind control type behavior. Awe and Terror are not appropriate for deities in some settings, like Tolkien's.
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Old 12-16-2018, 03:26 PM   #15
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

If there are 2 extremes they represent the Nadir and the Zenith. You cannot go above the Zenith or below the Nadir.

I have used sarcasm to state someone is so low they look up at the Nadir.

Charisma, Voice, Reputation and sex appeal etc can all help to sway one transcendent from another.
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Old 12-16-2018, 03:28 PM   #16
Vaevictis Asmadi
 
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

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Originally Posted by smurf View Post
Charisma, Voice, Reputation and sex appeal etc can all help to sway one transcendent from another.
But none of those traits represent static physical appearance. They represent behavior, sound of voice, social regard, and seduction. Like Awe and Terror, they represent something separate from what the person looks like.

Otherwise, it would be impossible for a character in fiction or GURPS to be Ugly with Charisma or Voice. But it's very plausible to imagine such a character. It's also possible to imagine somebody divinely beautiful with a horrible-sounding voice, or the social graces of a rock. Or a beautiful but mute angelic being.

Voice does not affect deaf people. Appearance does not affect blind people. Charisma and Reputation apparently affect both equally.
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Last edited by Vaevictis Asmadi; 12-16-2018 at 03:32 PM.
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Old 12-16-2018, 03:32 PM   #17
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

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Originally Posted by Vaevictis Asmadi View Post
Only in some settings. Not every setting has deities who engage in mind control type behavior. Awe and Terror are not appropriate for deities in some settings, like Tolkien's.
In Tolkien's worlds, the Awe and Terror would come from within the beholder. The Valar are too awesome for mortals to behold untransformed.
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Old 12-16-2018, 03:35 PM   #18
Vaevictis Asmadi
 
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

The Valar do not permanently inflict Slave Mentality or mental illness on everyone who looks at them. Doing so would make them evil. In Tolkien's universe, using Awe would be just as evil as Terror.

I am interested in how to depict Tolkien's world as he described it. The Valar enslaving people or destroying their minds isn't true to his writing. It never happens once in any of his stories. I don't think it happens in Greek myths about Aphrodite or the other Greek gods, either. They inspire worship and awe and sexual attraction and fear, but the mortals who interact with them don't normally come down with Slave Mentality, or lose their minds. Sometimes mortals, like Achilles, attack gods in battle.

I'm also interested in being able to depict beautiful beings who don't use seduction or sex appeal to convey, such as angels in some settings, uninterested in sex with mortals.

To say that all more-than-mortal angelic/divine beings look essentially the same, and the only difference is if they choose to enslave, seduce, or destroy the minds of their victims, just doesn't give a good set of options.
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I have Confused and Clueless. Sometimes I miss sarcasm and humor, or critically fail my Savoir-Faire roll. None of it is intentional.

Published GURPS Settings
(as of 4/2013 -- I hope to update it someday...)

Last edited by Vaevictis Asmadi; 12-16-2018 at 03:59 PM.
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Old 12-16-2018, 04:10 PM   #19
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaevictis Asmadi View Post
I'm also interested in being able to depict beautiful beings who don't use seduction or sex appeal to convey, such as angels in some settings, uninterested in sex with mortals.

To say that all more-than-mortal angelic/divine beings look essentially the same, and the only difference is if they choose to enslave, seduce, or destroy the minds of their victims, just doesn't give a good set of options.
You could just use Charisma (sense-based, vision). Or, to make it more like appearance levels, add an additional modifier to Charisma (in addition to sense-based) so that it only applies to reaction rolls (and not influence rolls or skills).

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Old 12-16-2018, 05:49 PM   #20
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Default Re: Appearance better than transcendent

Allure is another possibility, since it is vision-based. In effect, a goddess with Appearance (Transcendent) and Allure 4 would receive a +12 from anything sexually attracted to women. It would also work for elves, nymph, etc.

On a related note, I have had great success with using NPCs with phenomenal reaction modifiers to fool PCs. For example, a woman with Allure 4, Appearance (Very Beautiful), Charisma 5, and Voice receives a +9/+17 in her reactions. If she uses Sex Appeal on a PC, she can easily inflict a -17 to his or her rolls against her, as list overwhelms their good senses.
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