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Old 05-16-2019, 06:02 PM   #41
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

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Originally Posted by RyanW View Post
I'm thinking of using a somewhat similar mechanism for ST. Because my WIP rules decouple damage and hit points from a neat linear progression with ST, it's working out easier to say that ST doesn't give a set damage score, but instead gives a valid range of scores which are bought separately.
IMHO, even here the HP should be based on ST. It wouldn't be a linear relationship; but the number of HP that you get for free should still be calculated from ST in a way that causes them to fall somewhere within the the valid range that ST defines, and then can be bought up or down from there.
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Old 05-16-2019, 08:01 PM   #42
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

For context:


http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=13259
http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=33117
http://forums.sjgames.com/showthread.php?t=39222
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Old 05-16-2019, 08:11 PM   #43
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

I think that ST might need a little boost, since everyone complains about the price. How about allowing ST to serve as the universal energy reserve for powers (effectively creating a ninth secondary characteristic). Characters would receive one point of Energy Reserve (Universal, +25%) for every point of ST and, even if they did not have powers, they could one point of ER to gain +1 on any roll (maximum of a one +1 bonus per turn). Would it make ST worth 20 CP/level with Will, HP, Striking ST, and Lifting ST?

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Old 05-17-2019, 01:09 AM   #44
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

For what it's worth I don't see my players avoiding ST, and I don't think it's over-priced in general. In a low-action SF it could be, but I've yet to hear my players call ST over priced at 10/level, and they're playing in an actiony TL10-11 SF game. Now, they tend not to buy massive levels of ST unless it's what their character concept requires it, but they certainly don't think they (or their fellow players) are making a bad investment when they sink points into ST.
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Old 05-17-2019, 04:03 AM   #45
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

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  • Basic Speed = (DX + IN)/4, +/-5 per +/-0.25 (it's how quickly you react and act, so basically affects initiative and dodge, and makes up for IN losing PR and WL)
I could get behind Speed, Dodge and Initiative being derived from DX+Per. Basing them on IQ doesn't make as much sense for me.
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For what it's worth I don't see my players avoiding ST, and I don't think it's over-priced in general.
It's overpriced in terms of gaining dice on the ST-Damage table when compared to dice of Innate Attack.
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Old 05-17-2019, 07:22 AM   #46
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

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I could get behind Speed, Dodge and Initiative being derived from DX+Per. Basing them on IQ doesn't make as much sense for me..
That works for me too. I was hurrying. I'm supposed to be working, and I agree Per makes more sense.
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Old 05-17-2019, 09:37 AM   #47
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

Per makes no sense though for Basic Speed. At 5 CP/level for Per and 5 CP for +0.25 Basic Speed, it would always be better for an individual to purchase Per over Basic Speed, up to Per 20. IQ makes better sense because it would represent mental reaction while DX would represent physical reaction (Per is more details rather than speed anyway).
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Old 05-17-2019, 09:45 AM   #48
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

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For what it's worth I don't see my players avoiding ST, and I don't think it's over-priced in general. In a low-action SF it could be, but I've yet to hear my players call ST over priced at 10/level, and they're playing in an actiony TL1011 SF game. Now, they tend not to buy massive levels of ST unless it's what their character concept requires it, but they certainly don't think they (or their fellow players) are making a bad investment when they sink points into ST.
We've had whole threads about this. Some people like it where it is, some people like it lower. I don't think I've seen anyone say it should be higher.
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Old 05-17-2019, 10:19 AM   #49
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

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So effectively the old ST is now 12/level, and your new ST is 12/level at ST15+ because you must at that point pay for HP increases.

Fit and Very Fit are really good at the costs in the Basic Set. Making them count for FP limits, and the increase in HT cost make them nearly mandatory.
Yes, ST with HP got a bit costlier. It's mostly because I really wanted to not have another entangling thread and because HP are quite explicitly called out as being mass. You could go decrease ST to 8/level to keep things the same.

And of course I repriced all the associated advantages like Fit, Arm Strength and the like too. But I cut those in the example since we were talking about attributes and secondaries. Fit is 12 points in my version. Honestly, I think even if using RAW attribute costs Fit is underpriced for nearly every kind of character that is not a completely tight budget or really needs HT to boost HT-based skills and spells.
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Old 05-17-2019, 10:24 AM   #50
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Default Re: Revaluation of Attributes and Secondary Characteristics

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Per makes no sense though for Basic Speed. At 5 CP/level for Per and 5 CP for +0.25 Basic Speed, it would always be better for an individual to purchase Per over Basic Speed, up to Per 20. IQ makes better sense because it would represent mental reaction while DX would represent physical reaction (Per is more details rather than speed anyway).
That's an objection, a fair one, about pricing, not about making sense.

We could change the equation to (DX x2 + Per)/6 if that's an issue.
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