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Old 06-05-2018, 08:02 PM   #1
Rick_Smith
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Coquitlam B.C.
Default healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

Hi everyone,
The healing rules in GURPS 4th edition do not say that the healing is by combat or by wound.

For example, I'm in a fight and take 3 wounds for 3, 5 and 2 points of damage respectively (in that order). I'm at TL 4 so treating shock takes 30 minutes.

Can the party healer heal those three wounds SEPARATELY. That is, each separate wound is bandaged up and then he makes 3 skill rolls and I can recover 1d-2 damage from each wound (minimum 1 since the each wound was bandaged)?

***

It seems to me that I would want to track each wound separately so that if I have a small wound (say 1 point of damage) I heal a maximum of 1 point of damage to THAT wound.

Isn't it logical if I take 3 wounds well separated in time, (and each could be healed), that if I take 3 wound together, a good doctor can treat each wound?

Warm regards, Rick.
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Old 06-05-2018, 08:12 PM   #2
AlexanderHowl
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

No. Wounds are not treated separately in GURPS. You have to be wounded again, after the original First Aid roll, to allow for another First Aid attempt.

Last edited by AlexanderHowl; 06-05-2018 at 08:18 PM.
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Old 06-05-2018, 08:20 PM   #3
Rick_Smith
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Coquitlam B.C.
Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexanderHowl View Post
No. First aid treats all injury, not just one wound, just like every other form of healing in GURPS.
Hi Alexander,
Thanks for the quick reply. But logically, if I take one wound, (get it treated), then take another wound (get it treated), then take a third wound (and get it treated), surely it is logical that I can take 3 wounds at once, and get them each treated?

The rules talk about healing damage, but no where do they say that separate wounds glom together into one massive wound.

For example, I have 3 separate wounds written down on my character sheet. One damage, 7 damage, and 2 damage. The small wounds are pretty insignificant, little more than paper cuts. They could be bandaged and treated first, and then I get the big wound treated.

I appreciate your opinion, but does it actually say it works that way anywhere in the rules?

Warm regards, Rick.
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Old 06-05-2018, 11:12 PM   #4
Dalin
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Saint Paul, MN
Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick_Smith View Post
I appreciate your opinion, but does it actually say it works that way anywhere in the rules?
The language on B424 says that the aid-giver can "treat the victim for shock. He must keep the victim warm, comfortable, calm, and still." (Emphasis added.) This language suggests that the treatment is for the person, not for a particular wound. If you're lucky enough to get stabbed at 30 minute intervals, then you can benefit from first aid three times. Otherwise, just the once for all your new holes.

With that said, if your group wants to handle first aid differently, go for it.
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Old 06-06-2018, 12:26 AM   #5
evileeyore
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Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick_Smith View Post
Hi Alexander,
Thanks for the quick reply. But logically, if I take one wound, (get it treated), then take another wound (get it treated), then take a third wound (and get it treated), surely it is logical that I can take 3 wounds at once, and get them each treated?
Sure it's logical, but since wounds are only 'tracked separately' under specific circumstances*, it's not RAW.

Quote:
The rules talk about healing damage, but no where do they say that separate wounds glom together into one massive wound.
Basic, pg 380; Effects of Injury:
"If you are injured, subtract the points of injury from your Hit Points."

In fact, it states this in a few different areas. Nowhere does it say "keep a separate list of injuries", except in specific circumstances*. Thus, if you are just subtracting your injury amounts from your HP, you are just "gloming it together".


* Specifically if you take a Crippling Injury or Mortal Wound, you track that you took a Crippling Injury or Mortal Wound, but not the amount of injury done, just that they occurred because they have different methods required for healing them.


Quote:
For example, I have 3 separate wounds written down on my character sheet. One damage, 7 damage, and 2 damage.
That isn't how damage is tracked. What you do is subtract 1, 7, and 2 from your HP as take the injury, leaving you 10 HP down from whatever you started with after combat.

If that was HP 10, then you have now dropped to 0 HP, are making HT checks to remain conscious if you take any actions other than Do Nothing (presuming you made the check to remain conscious when you hit 0). Further, you took a major wound at some point and likely had to deal with that. You might have taken a Crippling Injury to an eye(s), at 1 HP (or 2 for both with a ruthless GM), but no other limb is affected by those amounts and 7 is beyond what you would take for any other Crippling Injury.



It is done this way for 'speed of play'. Thus you know the moment you hit certian HP thresholds (1/3, 0, negative multiples of HP) without having to 'do the math' every time you take injury.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalin View Post
With that said, if your group wants to handle first aid differently, go for it.
I do this in my games. As the GM. I don't have the Players track it separately (I do it personally), but then I also have a bit more complicated healing rate for crippling injuries and such, so I need to keep track for my house rules.

Last edited by evileeyore; 06-06-2018 at 03:42 AM.
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Old 06-06-2018, 12:28 AM   #6
Maz
 
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Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

In our game we track each individual wound. This is mostly for bleeding rules.
You have to bandage each wound sepparetly, and youd better start with the biggest wound first if you want your patient to survive!

In our games bandaging do not give back 1 hp. It only stops the bleeding. Which is also serious enough.

Treating shock is used once and heal HP lost in total. It isnt used on an individual wound.
You can only be treated for shock if you are wounded again. And not just if you only lost a couple of HP. But that very rarely happens.
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Old 06-06-2018, 12:38 AM   #7
Rick_Smith
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
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Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

I want to thank all of you guys for the great answers!

Thanks for taking the time for the fast, replies.

Regards, Rick.
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Old 06-06-2018, 01:56 PM   #8
Skarg
 
Join Date: May 2015
Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

(I'm the one Rick has been debating this with in the TFT forums. We always tracked and healed each wound in TFT, and always have done that in GURPS too, because it seemed too illogical to us not to (even when we were about 11 years old), due to thinking about and experiencing situations where it was clear one character was near death and out of action for weeks while another one who took similar wounds was all healed up, only because of when exactly the healer got to them).

For anyone interested, see Roleplayer 16, or GURPS Compendium II (pages 154-157) for optional advanced healing rules that offer another explanation and thoughtful details about how to apply this in GURPS.

I'm curious if anyone knows if those rules have been re-worked for 4e (not that there would be much difference except for the new wound categories in 4e like Mortal Wounds) and published anywhere?
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Old 06-06-2018, 03:30 PM   #9
Pursuivant
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

For First Aid, it seems more logical to base treatment time on total HP lost rather than individual wounds.

For example, a single wound which reduces a victim to -HP is likely to take more monitoring and treatment than multiple wounds which leave the victim at > HP/2.

E.g., single sucking chest wound from a gunshot vs. three grazing shots.

In the first case, you have to apply a gas-resistant barrier over both exit and exit wounds, apply pressure bandages, treat the victim for shock, apply direct pressure to try to slow down bleeding rate, monitor him to make sure that airway, breathing, and circulation don't go down the pan, and possibly administer plasma/blood expander, painkillers, and antibiotics.

In the latter case, you just need to make sure the wounds are clean (and blood, within reason, is pretty good at both cleaning out wounds and getting rid of hostile microbes), apply bandages, check for shock, ABC, more severe injury, and then properly position the patient until the bleeding stops. If the patient is conscious, they can slow down bleeding by applying direct pressure and/or elevating wounds themselves.

OTOH, for Surgery, multiple wounds mean more stitches (or whatever) and might take more time than treating a single relatively shallow, but dangerous wound (like a hit which nicks an artery in the arm or leg).

For healing, it makes sense to initially treat recovery of HP as "generic" until the victim gets to positive HP, then restore lost HP from least severe wound to most severe wound. For example, if you are hit by three grazes and a sucking chest wound which knock you down to -3 x HP, you're going to be in the ICU for a long time. Functionally, none of your wounds is likely to be fully healed. But, once you get back to 1 HP or higher, the GM can rule that your three grazing wounds (1 HP each) heal before your major wound which knocked you down to ((-3 x HP)+3).

Last edited by Pursuivant; 06-06-2018 at 03:38 PM.
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Old 06-06-2018, 03:44 PM   #10
Pursuivant
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Default Re: healing multiple wounds - is this OK?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
You have to bandage each wound sepparetly, and youd better start with the biggest wound first if you want your patient to survive!
This is realistic, although you start with the wounds which interfere with Airway/Breathing, or Circulation/Bleeding, and which will respond to First Aid, first rather than the one which looks worst.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz View Post
Treating shock is used once and heal HP lost in total. It isnt used on an individual wound.
This is mostly realistic, unless the aid-giver has some technology or treatment which keeps an individual injury from becoming "becoming worse than it is" for some reason other than bleeding. For example, splinting a broken limb might restore 1 HP if the GM rules that total potential HP loss would be greater if the leg wasn't properly splinted.
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