Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-10-2016, 01:17 AM   #11
sir_pudding
Wielder of Smart Pants
 
sir_pudding's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ventura CA
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donny Brook View Post
Old diving suits were flexible (though not the helmet) and sealed.
That is true of contemporary drysuits too, but the purpose of using a drysuit instead of a wetsuit is that drysuits allow divers to operate at colder temperatures. They don't have anything to do with pressure.
sir_pudding is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 01:38 AM   #12
Nereidalbel
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Ellicott City, MD
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donny Brook View Post
Old diving suits were flexible (though not the helmet) and sealed. Counterpressure kept the diver moving.
And they actually handled higher pressure than the cybersuit does. Doesn't harm my suspension of disbelief any.
Nereidalbel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 01:44 AM   #13
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
Having pressure support but not much DR is quite different from having pressure support but (lots of) flexible DR.


...I'm somewhat curious about the proposition that boiled, de-shelled eggs resist pressure, though.
It seems to be fine under some level of water, which exerts uniform pressure. Conversely, it tends to get damaged extremely easily when poked with a finger or a rather blunt chokpstick (surely chopsticks don't count as cutting/impaling!). Plus let us not forget that the air alone exerts a pressure of FOURTEEN POUNDS per each square inch of surface area. A finger or chopstick poke seems to be less than that.
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 03:22 AM   #14
Ulzgoroth
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
It seems to be fine under some level of water, which exerts uniform pressure. Conversely, it tends to get damaged extremely easily when poked with a finger or a rather blunt chokpstick (surely chopsticks don't count as cutting/impaling!). Plus let us not forget that the air alone exerts a pressure of FOURTEEN POUNDS per each square inch of surface area. A finger or chopstick poke seems to be less than that.
I'd expect a boiled egg could be sunk very deep indeed without being crushed, because (like a human or various other soft objects) it just pressurizes internally to match. That's not pressure support, at least as applies to armor. A layer of plastic wrap can do that fine for nearly arbitrary amounts of pressure.

Armor offering pressure support means it can sustain a pressure differential.
__________________
I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident.
Ulzgoroth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 03:25 AM   #15
Ulzgoroth
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
I think the reason this doesn't fit our sense of reality is we are overestimating the forces involved in 30 atm of pressure and underestimating the forces involved in blunt trauma damage. A punch powerful enough to deal more than 5 points of damage is going to be putting out a lot more force than 30 atm.

Sources: Google tells me that 30 atm is in the ballpark of 440 psi, and that the average heavyweight boxer's punch (which by gurps rules should sometimes but not always deal damage vs 40 flexible DR) inflicts a force of 1200 to 1700 psi. So even armor that doesn't protect from moderate punches should still be more than enough to resist 30 atm of ambient pressure.
Those 440 psi are over a whole lot more than 4 times the area. In terms of total forces, the punch doesn't come close.
__________________
I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident.
Ulzgoroth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 03:30 AM   #16
Flyndaran
Untagged
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Forest Grove, Beaverton, Oregon
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
I'd expect a boiled egg could be sunk very deep indeed without being crushed, because (like a human or various other soft objects) it just pressurizes internally to match. That's not pressure support, at least as applies to armor. A layer of plastic wrap can do that fine for nearly arbitrary amounts of pressure.

Armor offering pressure support means it can sustain a pressure differential.
There are many dangers with human under great pressure other than quick squishing.
3rd edition Gurps Blue Planet covers many of them. Because of those rules I consider it one of my most useful 3rd books that apply to 4th ed. games.
__________________
Beware, poor communication skills. No offense intended. If offended, it just means that I failed my writing skill check.

Last edited by Flyndaran; 10-10-2016 at 03:39 AM.
Flyndaran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 03:34 AM   #17
Ulzgoroth
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flyndaran View Post
There are many dangers with human and pressure other than quick squishing.
3rd edition Gurps Blue Planet covers many of them. Because of those rules I consider it one of my most useful 3rd books that apply to 4th ed. games.
...Yes, it's very difficult to crush a human with pressure so long as their air passages are filled to the same pressure (because our makeup is mostly incompressible) but some elements of our physiology start running into problems.

Which is why you want actual pressure support sometimes.
__________________
I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident.
Ulzgoroth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 03:42 AM   #18
vicky_molokh
GURPS FAQ Keeper
 
vicky_molokh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulzgoroth View Post
...Yes, it's very difficult to crush a human with pressure so long as their air passages are filled to the same pressure (because our makeup is mostly incompressible) but some elements of our physiology start running into problems.

Which is why you want actual pressure support sometimes.
Are you saying that deep-water fishes don't have actual pressure support?
__________________
Vicky 'Molokh', GURPS FAQ and uFAQ Keeper
vicky_molokh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 03:49 AM   #19
Nereidalbel
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: Ellicott City, MD
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
Are you saying that deep-water fishes don't have actual pressure support?
That's their native pressure, and for many of them, coming up to the surface is a good way to end up dead. For life evolved on Mars, humans would be the ones with Pressure Support.
Nereidalbel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2016, 04:01 AM   #20
Ulzgoroth
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Default Re: Cybersuit -- Submersible or Not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
Are you saying that deep-water fishes don't have actual pressure support?
They might, but they don't necessarily. Pressure support, like Temperature Tolerance, increases the size of your comfort zone. It's not needed if you're just shifting where that zone is centered. I don't know whether their range of tolerance is wide enough to need it.


Regardless of that, what I'm actually saying is that wearing a deep-water fish (or a hard-boiled egg) won't provide you with any pressure support benefits. Having Pressure Support doesn't really require structural strength, but for equipment to provide Pressure Support very much does.
__________________
I don't know any 3e, so there is no chance that I am talking about 3e rules by accident.
Ulzgoroth is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
cybersuit, help me out here, pressure support

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:22 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.