DR and IT vs Leech

[JCurwen3]

Just wanted a clarification about what DR and different forms of IT do to affect Leech...

Does Leech do damage (and if so, of what type... toxic maybe?), or direct injury? If it does direct injury, then obviously DR doesn't affect it and that's a moot point.

But what of IT?

Based on p. P96...
"Leech only affects living beings. It can’t steal HP from machines or inanimate objects"
... I would surmise that IT:Unliving prevents it entirely, but then again, undead have IT:Unliving and they're hardly machines or inanimate objects. So which sentence in that quote trumps the other - the broader or more narrow one?

How about IT:Diffuse? Does it limit Leech injury to 2 HP per attack, if the Leech hasn't been made into an area effect, cone, or (somehow, oddly) some form of explosion? The RAW suggests that yes, it would, but the RAW in the Basic Set were written prior to Leech. And honestly IT:Diffuse affecting Leech in this way... I'm just not sure it should apply or help.

It feels like it makes sense to me that IT:DR works against Leech. If there is any objection to this one, I'd be curious why.

[Walrus]

Leech is specifically Malediction-like ability which doesn't inflict damage and damage type but inflicts direct injury (while it can still cause Hazard).

What is Living is the question of setting, not the ability. Some living creatures can have IT: (Unliving-like) but be living and vice versa. I'd suggest just having FP as the criteria. And it actually allows Leech (Mechanical) as specific ability, so I think Leech (Undead energy) or Leech (Non-living beings) are also available.

[lachimba]

Yes IT unliving is just a name and as such suffers the same issue as every other trait in GURPS. Sometimes the name is appropriate... and sometimes not.

You can have IT or not have it and still be living or unliving.

Haivng FP or feature 'not living' and appropriate traits + taboo traits seems more relevant.

[JCurwen3]

Originally Posted by lachimba

Yes IT unliving is just a name and as such suffers the same issue as every other trait in GURPS. Sometimes the name is appropriate... and sometimes not.

You can have IT or not have it and still be living or unliving.

Haivng FP or feature 'not living' and appropriate traits + taboo traits seems more relevant.

I take your point, and yes, IT:Unliving just really confers IT in the ways common to unliving things, but technically some freak lifeform could have it.

But saying "not living" is a feature, I think that would only play as 0 pts if there was an established Leech (Not living) that they would still be affected by, or other cons to balance the pro of being immune to regular Leech. And it's a trope in some vampire fiction of vampires being able to feed on each other, despite not being living, whilst of course still being perfectly capable of feeding on the living too.

What about IT:Diffuse? Should its 2 HP cap apply to Leech? Nowhere in the rules does it suggest otherwise, but does that feel right, that it should help against something like a life drain?

And any issues with IT:DR reducing the effects? This one I think is straightforward and makes sense.

[lachimba]

Originally Posted by JCurwen3

But saying "not living" is a feature.

Well that was just a flippant comment... :)

But seriously I think it is a feature (like machine) that has certain other required traits. They may or may not prevent leech depening on certain other factors.

Then again IDHMBWM so I may change my mind if I reread the RAW.

[Psychotime]

Since Diffuse is supposed to be for stuff like Logia Devil Fruit users and creatures made out of swarms of other creatures, I don't think your average Leech is gonna be able to grab/hug/whatever well enough to be able to sap them.

And Damage Reduction sounds purely GM's call. RAW I don't think it applies at all, so a Leech can sap away, but that said I really don't like the sound of that given the nature of the advantage.

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by JCurwen3

Just wanted a clarification about what DR and different forms of IT do to affect Leech...

Does Leech do damage (and if so, of what type... toxic maybe?), or direct injury? If it does direct injury, then obviously DR doesn't affect it and that's a moot point.

It does direct injury.

But what of IT?

Based on p. P96...
"Leech only affects living beings. It can’t steal HP from machines or inanimate objects"
... I would surmise that IT:Unliving prevents it entirely, but then again, undead have IT:Unliving and they're hardly machines or inanimate objects. So which sentence in that quote trumps the other - the broader or more narrow one?

Usually it wouldn't work on "undead". It works on living things and they aren't. But that has nothing necessarily to do with IT: Unliving.

How about IT:Diffuse? Does it limit Leech injury to 2 HP per attack, if the Leech hasn't been made into an area effect, cone, or (somehow, oddly) some form of explosion?

I wouldn't say so. I'd say that Leech works normally on people with diffuse.

It feels like it makes sense to me that IT:DRis any objection to this one, I'd be curious why works against Leech. If there

I see no reason why being a mass of, let's say goo, would help against let's say, "life force drain".

[David Johnston2]

Originally Posted by JCurwen3

But saying "not living" is a feature, I think that would only play as 0 pts if there was an established Leech (Not living) that they would still be affected by, or other cons to balance the pro of being immune to regular Leech. And it's a trope in some vampire fiction of vampires being able to feed on each other, despite not being living, whilst of course still being perfectly capable of feeding on the living too..

I would assume those vampires are not in fact undead. Being a vampire doesn't automatically mean that you are an animate corpse after all. Nor would it automatically be the case that you'd need another form of Leech that affected undead. After all, there might or might not be people with True Faith that can affect undead and demons and not much else.