[4e] Casting through familiars

[Emerald Cat]

Originally Posted by roguebfl

Granted by Ally just needs the ally present, it doesn not have "I chhose to stop giving them it" clause. That's part of Pact.

Actually, that is explicitly part of the Granted by (Other) limitations, of which Granted by Familiar is an example. From GURPS Power-Ups 8: Limitations (p. 14): "This is a significant limitation because the ability is inherent to the granter, not you. Thus, if he wishes to deny you access to it, for any reason, you immediately lose it." (Emphasis as original)

I think throwing your familiar at the enemy is a sufficient reason for them to cut you off from your powers. If the player was otherwise nice to their familiar, I would let them off with the warning the first time.

Abusive mages or repeat offenders would lose the familiar completely. At that point, the familiar would permanently cut off the mage's powers.

[Emerald Cat]

A tortoise would be a great familiar for a mage who wanted to pull the deliver-spells-by-throwing-my-familiar-at-the-enemy stunt.

Tortoises have DR, which makes them far less likely to be one shot by enemies than other familiars. Additionally, this can justify the mage getting more DR themselves.

Come to think of it, a mage might be better off getting DR with the Granted by Familiar limitation and running up to the enemy to deliver spells because a human can easily get armor. Blacksmiths don't make tortoise armor in most settings.

Depending on the SM of your fairy, you wouldn't have to worry too much about enemies hitting them, though. My problem is that if you are throwing them long distances with enough force to bounce off you are probably causing your familiar appreciable collision damage. That kind of behavior should make your familiar consider leaving you.

[starslayer]

Originally Posted by Emerald Cat

A tortoise would be a great familiar for a mage who wanted to pull the deliver-spells-by-throwing-my-familiar-at-the-enemy stunt.

Tortoises have DR, which makes them far less likely to be one shot by enemies than other familiars. Additionally, this can justify the mage getting more DR themselves.

Come to think of it, a mage might be better off getting DR with the Granted by Familiar limitation and running up to the enemy to deliver spells because a human can easily get armor. Blacksmiths don't make tortoise armor in most settings.

Depending on the SM of your fairy, you wouldn't have to worry too much about enemies hitting them, though. My problem is that if you are throwing them long distances with enough force to bounce off you are probably causing your familiar appreciable collision damage. That kind of behavior should make your familiar consider leaving you.

Your assuming;

1. Your familiar has a choice in the matter: Minion (slave mentality), summonable.
2. Your familiar is not OK with this (Familiar has unkillable 2, 3, daredevil/on the edge disadvantage, just enjoys going from 'useless bird on mages shoulder' to 'death missile that must be feared').
3. Your familiar finds this behavior 'bad' (Familiar has impulsiveness, bloodlust, berserk)

One would assume that if you are building a PC who is going to employ this technique, you will have an ally familiar who is compatible with it.

[Emerald Cat]

Originally Posted by starslayer

Your assuming;

1. Your familiar has a choice in the matter: Minion (slave mentality), summonable.
2. Your familiar is not OK with this (Familiar has unkillable 2, 3, daredevil/on the edge disadvantage, just enjoys going from 'useless bird on mages shoulder' to 'death missile that must be feared').
3. Your familiar finds this behavior 'bad' (Familiar has impulsiveness, bloodlust, berserk)

One would assume that if you are building a PC who is going to employ this technique, you will have an ally familiar who is compatible with it.

1. Fair enough, but I would reduce the limitation value of Granted by Familiar to about -20% to reflect the fact that your ally can no longer take away your abilities (a major part of that limitation).

2. The familiar having an advantage that allows them to do this safely does eliminate a lot of issues. Of course, becoming a feared death missile is a good argument to get the permission of your familiar.

3. Disadvantages are a good way to ensure the familiar is willing. But be ready for pesky GM questions like "Why does your parrot have the Bloodthirsty disadvantage?"

[Bruno]

There's also consequences of having Unkillable, High DR, Bloodthirsty familiars with Supernatural Durability.

They're expensive, for one. A familiar is an Ally after all, and all that point-cost-raising-stuff hits you in your point-wallet.

There's also the problem of when your Ally gets it in their evil, invulnerable little head that they want to bite the ear off that town guard that just called them an obnoxious parrot. You can avoid that by paying the Minion surcharge, but we're back to more expensive again.

You can take Slave Mentality, but frankly by this point I'm wondering why you don't just take Throw Spell and use that instead of THROWING your Familiar at people. It's a lot cheaper, more reliable, and doesn't put your expensive Ally advantage at risk where someone else can pick it up and put it in their pocket.

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In the slightly-less-wacky interpretation of the idea, I'm wondering if it's not just Telecast combined with Clairesentience that lets you scry the area your Familiar is in, or Possession (Familiar Only) combined with the Mind Link advantage to possess your familiar from any distance.

[Jose]

Its a little necromancy here, but it seems the main thing a familiar can do with its own points is scouting?
There is no real way of having the familiar assist my character in casting spells as most spells in the magic as skills system are cast individually.
Only real thing I can think of is giving it magic symbols and teaching it the same spells as my character.
The biggest strecth Im thinking about is giving its some fatigue points that my caster can draw on.

[Gnomasz]

Originally Posted by Jose

Its a little necromancy here, but it seems the main thing a familiar can do with its own points is scouting?
There is no real way of having the familiar assist my character in casting spells as most spells in the magic as skills system are cast individually.
Only real thing I can think of is giving it magic symbols and teaching it the same spells as my character.
The biggest strecth Im thinking about is giving its some fatigue points that my caster can draw on.

There's no need to stretch, You can teach Your familiar the Share Energy spell. It might also have unique abilities that support the caster, like the familiars in d20 do. The easiest way to model this is with the Affects Others enhancement from Powers, but if You don't have access to it, an Affliction or a spell or two will do. A familiar might even be a pretty combative demon. What's possible depends mostly on GM's choice.