WWII + Supers = ???

[christ0pher]

ok, here's my dilemma, while planning a new campaign based around the start of the second World War, the question came up of what would happen if Super Humans were introduced into the mix...

I'm looking for "realistic" global repercussions from making about 1 in every 1,000 people Super. The average would be 250 points, the exceptional would be 500 points, and a small few would be 700+ points.

Is the war over in a week?
Does it go on for decades?

Any help/suggestions/comments would be appreciated.

[Argent]

It depends on the distribution and powers of the supers. Read the City of Heroes story for a coherent vision of superhgumans mixed with a representation of history.

[Pesterfield]

http://www.goldenyears.cjb.net/ has some comics online, including ones from WW2.

In most comics supers either stick with the small stuff, at most giving minor aid to their side, or fight the other sides supers basically cancelling each other out.

[chazuli]

A game called Godlike, published by Pagan deals with this exact issue. The mechanics for that game are pretty uneven, but the background and research they did was pretty good. I'd recommend checking it out. They had a couple of supplements that dealt with the Germans paranormals and the Allied paranormals. I played in a campaign of it for about a year and all in all it was a lot of fun.

Hope this helps.

Best,
Charles Millar

[christ0pher]

Originally Posted by chazuli

A game called Godlike, published by Pagan deals with this exact issue.

That's actually the "flavor" I was aiming for. I've looked at a couple Godlike sites, and I guess their solution to "Der Uberman vinning der var" is that the supers on either side cancel each other out.

I also checked out the City of Heroes history section suggested by Argent, thanks by the way, but it's too 4-color for my tastes. I did like the part about the Heroes realizing they worked better, and had higher survival rates, as Special Operations Commando groups instead of infantry grunts.

[vesper]

I believe that the supers might not cancel each other out as much as they would increase the lethality for non-supers. This probably would not change the length but make it a bit nastier. The gadgeteers may up the high tech stakes but they too would be on both sides.
vesper

[Gef]

I remember a discussion on the mailing list about how powerful a wizard could be with the spell Enlarge, swatting the peasant levies with giant muscles. I argued that no military commander would prefer the wizard to cavalry, who inflict huge damage with lances and the horses' giant muscles. You can train cavalry as a unit.

Recently in my supers campaign the PC team lost big against a foe of lower point total: He had Body of Wood and just enough ST to hoist a 50 calibre machinegun. Ouch. In a WWII campaign, can the blasters match the performance of squad level weapons, or use them as individuals? Can you get enough of one kind of super to train them as a unit? Normal infantry squads could carry large weapons but could big guns but couldn't use them on the move. A whole squad of ST 30 mutants, wearing heavy armor and carrying water-cooled MGs with huge ammo loads, could breach any normal infantry line, but they'd take losses. Could those losses be recouped? Or are super powers too variable to train in groups? Historically, secret weapons have not won wars. Supers with a high variability in powers are like secret weapons that never get past the prototype stage.

If I were a WWII-era government and ou presented with super powers, I'd regard you as a national treasure. I'd want to know how your powers worked and if I could reproduce them through science or breeding. If your kid had the same powers, maybe I'd let you go to the front.

I can see telepathy and phasing being of immense value to spies. If only one side had superspies, it would heavily influence outcomes. If both sides have them, how do you keep the tepes from making common cause and mind-controling the government on both sides to create a new world order with mutants on top?

GEF

[Argent]

Originally Posted by Gef

Historically, secret weapons have not won wars.

What about at Hiroshima?

[LoneWolf23k]

Originally Posted by Gef

I remember a discussion on the mailing list about how powerful a wizard could be with the spell Enlarge, swatting the peasant levies with giant muscles. I argued that no military commander would prefer the wizard to cavalry, who inflict huge damage with lances and the horses' giant muscles. You can train cavalry as a unit.

Perhaps, but the Enlarged Wizard would have an incredible impact on the morale of the enemy forces. A cavalry charge is intimidating, but any pikeman worth his salt knows that nothing stops a cavalry charge better then a line of pikes. But how do you beat a giant swatting away your forces like a mighty, inhuman beast? It's kind of like arguing that a general would never prefer a tank to a unit of infantry with bazookas and grenade launchers.

[zogo]

Originally Posted by Gef

I remember a discussion on the mailing list about how powerful a wizard could be with the spell Enlarge, swatting the peasant levies with giant muscles. I argued that no military commander would prefer the wizard to cavalry, who inflict huge damage with lances and the horses' giant muscles. You can train cavalry as a unit.

Recently in my supers campaign the PC team lost big against a foe of lower point total: He had Body of Wood and just enough ST to hoist a 50 calibre machinegun.
GEF

You see to me this gets to the heart of a particularly important issue. That is the difference between Supers and a Neorealism* that includes superhuman.

In the latter the best non-gageteer supers can hope for is to be of minor use in any given application there will not be enough of them to matter on a large scale. Fortunately there will be no supervillains as such as most supers will be able to make a legitamate fortune. Unless of course all supers are hunted down like dogs which is also possible.

In the former Supers don't change the history of WWII so much but its because they cancel out or rather that Allied Supers spend all their time fighting the evil schemes of Nazi umermensch.

*Neo since not including supernatural elements is a defining characteristic of the genre of Realism.