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Old 12-29-2007, 09:55 AM   #1
Žorkell
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Default The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

I was looking at the e23 wishlist and it doesn't list a single GURPS WWII title.

The books for Japan and the USSR still haven't been released (and I don't really know if they've been written yet).

So, bearing those two things in mind. Is the line dead?

Please note that I'm not asking for a 4e update of GURPS WWII, just wondering if there's life still in the line.
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Old 12-29-2007, 03:33 PM   #2
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

Quote:
Originally Posted by Žorkell
I was looking at the e23 wishlist and it doesn't list a single GURPS WWII title.

The books for Japan and the USSR still haven't been released (and I don't really know if they've been written yet).

So, bearing those two things in mind. Is the line dead?
Given the sheer volume of work involved with the WWII line, I guess it's a case of tying down a roomful of authors for a loooong time.
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Old 01-03-2008, 09:46 AM   #3
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

Though my game is on hiatus while I am working in Hungary, WWII is the only GURPS I play regularly and I am sure to get back to it when I return to Australia in June. If they were to release anything I would buy it. I'm fine with updates or more 3e material. Just give me more WWII GURPS... please... if anyone out there is listening.
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Old 01-05-2008, 06:48 AM   #4
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

I dimly recall mention of the WW2 line not giving adequate return on investment AND problems with the authors causing Japan and the USSR to not be published.

My memory might not be good though.
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Old 01-06-2008, 09:12 AM   #5
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

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Originally Posted by Z09SS
I dimly recall mention of the WW2 line not giving adequate return on investment AND problems with the authors causing Japan and the USSR to not be published.
That's not quite accurate. Yes, the WWII line showed declining sales, but it was always SJG's intent to publish the Russia and Japan sourcebooks, at least, to complete the "major powers" subline. However, the first draft of the Russia book was rejected and deemed unsalvageable, for reasons that I'm not going to discuss (especially almost four years removed from the decision -- I might misstate the case, and that wouldn't be fair to the author) and as we were bearing down on the Fourth Edition launch, WWII got back-burnered. The Japan book never got past the planning stages; I think one chapter might have been written, but I could well be mistaken about that.

I think one of the big problems, in retrospect, was the heavy reliance on the small-format books in the WWII line. Had e23 been operating back then, we certainly would have made most or all of those PDF-only releases instead, and that might have made them more cost-effective and allowed the staff to focus more on getting the big books done faster and more easily. Nothing to be done about it at this late juncture, of course.
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Old 01-06-2008, 10:06 AM   #6
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

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Originally Posted by Andrew Hackard
The Japan book never got past the planning stages; I think one chapter might have been written, but I could well be mistaken about that.
I handed in a complete First Draft of the Armoury and Motor Pool sections in February 2004. I am fairly certain Shawn Fisher also handed in his chaptre on the Leathernecks in the Pacific.

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Old 01-07-2008, 04:26 AM   #7
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

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Originally Posted by HANS
I handed in a complete First Draft of the Armoury and Motor Pool sections in February 2004. I am fairly certain Shawn Fisher also handed in his chaptre on the Leathernecks in the Pacific.
Just to point out the bleedin' obvious - either of those could very likely be made into standalone PDF documents for e23 without too much stretching. Someone at SJGames might want to review the archives, if the full book definitely isn't going to happen.
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Old 01-07-2008, 08:28 AM   #8
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

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Originally Posted by Phil Masters
Just to point out the bleedin' obvious - either of those could very likely be made into standalone PDF documents for e23 without too much stretching. Someone at SJGames might want to review the archives, if the full book definitely isn't going to happen.
The chapters would likely have to be rewritten; a couple thousand words have a very different style depending on if they're intended to be part of a larger project, or if they're intended to stand alone.

But the sad fact is that WWII PDFs consistently under-perform, in terms of sales. Of five original such products on e23, none have broken 200 sales, even after two years of availability. It's hard to cover the baseline costs -- those expenses that don't vary based on project size -- with those numbers.

There are a number of possible alternatives we'll try before writing WWII's epitaph, but right now, we've got a number of projects that have a much higher priority.
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Old 01-07-2008, 12:33 PM   #9
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

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Originally Posted by Paul
There are a number of possible alternatives we'll try before writing WWII's epitaph, but right now, we've got a number of projects that have a much higher priority.
IOW, it's in the hospital and the outcome is uncertain but we have this treatment we could try?
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Old 01-07-2008, 01:26 PM   #10
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Default Re: The continuing life of the GURPS WWII line

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul
But the sad fact is that WWII PDFs consistently under-perform, in terms of sales. Of five original such products on e23, none have broken 200 sales, even after two years of availability. It's hard to cover the baseline costs -- those expenses that don't vary based on project size -- with those numbers.
Is there a magic number of sales that indicate a product is a success? In other words, how many extra copies would we have to buy? :p

'Doomed White Eagle' sold best, if I remember correctly, and made it just over 200. The Romanian sourcebook was the next highest. DWE did stay on the 'What's Hot' list for a long time. It was there until about six months ago, but then I guess e23 is really only coming of age now.

The PDFs might not have been bestsellers, but the sales that did come through indicated that it is the country sourcebooks people want. Poland is a minor nation as far as players are concerned, I think, and so the Polish book only just broke 200. I still believe a Soviet or Japanese book might get the general GURPS population a bit more excited.

I think the Weird War 2 adventure was too campaign specific and the other was very loose, more a scenario outline than a free, fun adventure for a few starting players. I think a loose adventure about an infantry squad with some vehicles, some fun, some personal stakes, and a chance to use a wide range of skills would have shown off what the campaign could do. The Battle of Midway one was good, and a brave attempt but too much just a run down of history. An introductory adventure that felt a bit like a classic, fun WWII squad movie would have helped out the line I think.

I suspect some people think the line is dead so maybe they are not investing money in trying it out.
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